1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:06,257 --> 00:00:07,758 (pencil grinding on paper) 3 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:10,052 (clicking) 4 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 5 00:00:13,973 --> 00:00:16,809 (people chatting) 6 00:00:29,405 --> 00:00:32,658 (relaxing piano music) 7 00:00:33,743 --> 00:00:34,994 - There you go. 8 00:00:43,461 --> 00:00:44,962 - [Stewart] Oh, yeah. 9 00:00:45,004 --> 00:00:45,796 - Mammoth. 10 00:00:45,838 --> 00:00:46,756 - Oh. - Wow. 11 00:00:48,841 --> 00:00:51,010 - [Stewart] It's a tusk in here. 12 00:00:54,305 --> 00:00:56,056 Beautifully preserved specimen. 13 00:00:58,768 --> 00:01:00,186 - [George] You think those are part of it? 14 00:01:00,227 --> 00:01:02,104 (indistinct) 15 00:01:02,146 --> 00:01:03,731 - [George] That's useful for us. 16 00:01:07,067 --> 00:01:07,985 (freezer door clicking) 17 00:01:08,027 --> 00:01:10,863 (freezer hissing) 18 00:01:12,448 --> 00:01:16,702 (lady speaking in foreign language) 19 00:01:18,621 --> 00:01:20,372 - All right. - The main event. 20 00:01:20,414 --> 00:01:21,248 Great. 21 00:01:22,166 --> 00:01:23,459 - [Lady] Mammoth's trunk. 22 00:01:23,501 --> 00:01:24,627 - Wow. - Oh yeah, 23 00:01:24,668 --> 00:01:26,795 you can see that. - Yeah, you can see it. 24 00:01:26,837 --> 00:01:30,216 - [George] So we would like to help you get DNA sequence. 25 00:01:30,257 --> 00:01:32,009 (lady speaking in foreign language) 26 00:01:32,051 --> 00:01:33,426 - DNA, okay. 27 00:01:36,263 --> 00:01:38,515 - [Lady] We finally got some hair. 28 00:01:38,557 --> 00:01:40,976 - This is not an ancient artifact. 29 00:01:42,728 --> 00:01:46,482 Using DNA, we can bring back extinct species. 30 00:01:47,775 --> 00:01:49,735 So this is the once in the future mammoth 31 00:01:49,777 --> 00:01:51,277 that we're looking at. 32 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:53,989 It has been gone for a while and with any luck, 33 00:01:54,031 --> 00:01:55,115 they are on the way back. 34 00:01:55,282 --> 00:01:58,160 (dramatic rumbling) 35 00:01:58,202 --> 00:02:02,039 (relaxing upbeat piano music) 36 00:02:04,583 --> 00:02:05,501 - [Mike] Stewart is a lot 37 00:02:05,543 --> 00:02:08,670 like the great American P. T. Barnum. 38 00:02:08,711 --> 00:02:11,131 - [Man] Stewart is the intellectual Johnny Appleseed 39 00:02:11,298 --> 00:02:12,842 of the counterculture. 40 00:02:13,008 --> 00:02:16,387 - Stewart might be the Zelig or maybe the DaVinci 41 00:02:16,428 --> 00:02:17,805 of cyber culture. 42 00:02:19,431 --> 00:02:21,141 - [George] It's actually a little bit eerie 43 00:02:21,183 --> 00:02:23,352 how often Stewart has been at the right place 44 00:02:23,477 --> 00:02:24,937 at the right time. 45 00:02:24,978 --> 00:02:26,689 - He's like an invincible string. 46 00:02:26,856 --> 00:02:28,399 - [George] And by the time all the rest of us get there, 47 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:31,110 he's gone on to something else more interesting. 48 00:02:31,151 --> 00:02:33,153 - [Man] Stewart has this remarkable 49 00:02:33,195 --> 00:02:35,531 "Forrest Gump" superpower-- 50 00:02:35,573 --> 00:02:37,283 - I believe he said he had to go pee. 51 00:02:37,324 --> 00:02:39,618 - [Man] To sense where the frontiers are 52 00:02:39,660 --> 00:02:41,370 and then be there. 53 00:02:41,412 --> 00:02:42,371 - [Man] He's like Kilroy. 54 00:02:42,538 --> 00:02:43,539 (atomic bomb exploding) 55 00:02:43,581 --> 00:02:44,957 He shows up in the background 56 00:02:44,999 --> 00:02:46,876 of every important thing going on. 57 00:02:49,503 --> 00:02:51,380 - [Carolyn] He could see into the future 58 00:02:51,422 --> 00:02:54,675 that this technology was going to be a huge part 59 00:02:54,716 --> 00:02:55,718 of American culture. 60 00:02:55,759 --> 00:02:57,011 - Welcome Stewart Brand. 61 00:02:57,052 --> 00:02:58,971 - [Man] It isn't so much that he's ahead of it, 62 00:02:59,013 --> 00:03:01,056 he's actually creating the future. 63 00:03:01,098 --> 00:03:02,892 - Steve Jobs, not surprisingly, 64 00:03:02,933 --> 00:03:05,060 was fascinated by Stewart. 65 00:03:05,102 --> 00:03:07,730 - When I was young the "Whole Earth Catalog" 66 00:03:07,771 --> 00:03:10,399 was one of the Bibles of my generation. 67 00:03:10,441 --> 00:03:13,152 It was created by a fellow named Stewart Brand. 68 00:03:13,193 --> 00:03:16,405 It was sort of like Google in paperback form 35 years 69 00:03:16,447 --> 00:03:17,865 before Google came along. 70 00:03:19,033 --> 00:03:22,453 - [Brian] So many of the ideas that you may find vital 71 00:03:22,494 --> 00:03:24,496 either originate with Stewart Brand 72 00:03:24,538 --> 00:03:27,750 or were really articulated by him. 73 00:03:27,791 --> 00:03:30,628 - [Man] Ideas that scene at the edge of believability 74 00:03:30,669 --> 00:03:32,463 from the environmental movement, 75 00:03:32,504 --> 00:03:35,799 to the technological movement, to genetics. 76 00:03:38,344 --> 00:03:42,473 - [Hunter] Stu loves being the techno file with the answer. 77 00:03:43,557 --> 00:03:46,852 But technologies tend to break people apart. 78 00:03:46,894 --> 00:03:49,313 (waves swishing) 79 00:03:49,355 --> 00:03:52,566 - [Man] Stewart is an evangelical optimist 80 00:03:52,608 --> 00:03:54,817 which may be quite dangerous. 81 00:03:57,905 --> 00:03:59,406 - [Man] He's famous for saying, 82 00:03:59,448 --> 00:04:01,283 "We are as Gods, 83 00:04:01,325 --> 00:04:03,118 "so we might as well get good at it" 84 00:04:03,243 --> 00:04:05,162 (typewriter clicking) 85 00:04:05,204 --> 00:04:09,625 (relaxing upbeat instrumental music) 86 00:04:17,841 --> 00:04:21,136 (footsteps crunching on sand) 87 00:04:21,178 --> 00:04:24,306 (crickets chirping) 88 00:04:24,348 --> 00:04:27,768 (rain trickling on roof) 89 00:04:34,525 --> 00:04:37,194 (door clicking) 90 00:04:41,907 --> 00:04:43,742 - My own progress through life 91 00:04:45,369 --> 00:04:47,579 has been to try stuff early on 92 00:04:47,621 --> 00:04:49,623 when there aren't rules against it yet 93 00:04:51,417 --> 00:04:54,253 so you get to be part of the new thing in the world. 94 00:04:56,880 --> 00:05:00,968 I didn't sit down in life to have a trajectory. 95 00:05:01,010 --> 00:05:03,095 It is a pretty interesting way to have a life 96 00:05:03,137 --> 00:05:06,640 'cause you get to be surprised a lot. 97 00:05:10,561 --> 00:05:12,563 I was born, I'm told, 98 00:05:12,604 --> 00:05:13,480 (Stewart chuckling) 99 00:05:13,522 --> 00:05:15,149 I don't remember it, 100 00:05:15,190 --> 00:05:16,984 in Rockford, Illinois. 101 00:05:17,026 --> 00:05:20,696 (baby Stewart crying) 102 00:05:20,738 --> 00:05:23,198 (lady laughing) 103 00:05:23,365 --> 00:05:26,201 (birds chirping) 104 00:05:26,243 --> 00:05:29,705 (upbeat organ music) 105 00:05:29,872 --> 00:05:31,790 We were a Midwestern family. 106 00:05:32,707 --> 00:05:36,003 My father was a civil engineer out of MIT 107 00:05:36,045 --> 00:05:38,422 and I got from him respect for that kind 108 00:05:38,464 --> 00:05:41,300 of problem solving that engineers love to do. 109 00:05:43,218 --> 00:05:45,929 And I took after my mother in the sense 110 00:05:45,971 --> 00:05:48,182 that she was mad for books. 111 00:05:49,850 --> 00:05:52,394 I know my mother was instilling values 112 00:05:52,436 --> 00:05:55,189 of caring about wildlife. 113 00:05:57,649 --> 00:06:00,986 (birds chirping) 114 00:06:01,028 --> 00:06:03,572 This is kind of where I grew up and I'm back 115 00:06:03,614 --> 00:06:06,241 in this cottage 63 years, basically, 116 00:06:06,283 --> 00:06:08,368 after I left at the age of 16. 117 00:06:09,703 --> 00:06:11,538 This is where all the fun stuff was. 118 00:06:12,414 --> 00:06:14,833 (baby Stewart giggling) 119 00:06:14,875 --> 00:06:16,502 I got to be a free-range kid. 120 00:06:21,840 --> 00:06:25,052 - I remember Stewart as a kid who is really interested 121 00:06:25,094 --> 00:06:28,764 in animals and would get into mischief 122 00:06:28,806 --> 00:06:30,349 that way fairly often. 123 00:06:30,390 --> 00:06:33,060 (duck quacking) 124 00:06:34,394 --> 00:06:36,647 - I was very much in cahoots with wildlife 125 00:06:36,688 --> 00:06:38,982 like the chipmunks and squirrels. 126 00:06:39,024 --> 00:06:41,693 I had an opossum named Frank 127 00:06:41,735 --> 00:06:44,196 I had a wonderful raccoon named Oscar. 128 00:06:45,531 --> 00:06:49,827 There was a feral cat and he became my friend. 129 00:06:49,868 --> 00:06:52,538 And when we left out the road, 130 00:06:52,704 --> 00:06:55,582 the cat chased the car all the way out to the highway. 131 00:06:55,624 --> 00:06:59,586 (Stewart imitating a gulp) 132 00:06:59,628 --> 00:07:01,588 - [Mike] Stewart was already smart 133 00:07:02,840 --> 00:07:04,550 and he went off to Stanford. 134 00:07:06,927 --> 00:07:09,054 - I've been a conservationist all my life. 135 00:07:09,096 --> 00:07:14,059 And I was trained as a biologist back in the '50s. 136 00:07:14,101 --> 00:07:15,310 At Stanford, I went 137 00:07:15,352 --> 00:07:17,479 in the direction of ecology and evolution. 138 00:07:19,481 --> 00:07:23,152 - We have an extremely serious world demographic situation. 139 00:07:23,193 --> 00:07:26,780 Famine and plague and thermonuclear war, 140 00:07:26,822 --> 00:07:29,992 and who knows which one or what combination will come? 141 00:07:30,033 --> 00:07:31,827 - I'm Paul Ehrlich, 142 00:07:31,869 --> 00:07:34,329 president of the Center for Conservation Biology 143 00:07:34,371 --> 00:07:39,293 at Stanford University and notorious doomsayer. 144 00:07:40,919 --> 00:07:41,753 Doom. 145 00:07:44,798 --> 00:07:47,301 - [Stewart] Paul Ehrlich was my advisor 146 00:07:47,342 --> 00:07:49,136 for the field work that I was doing. 147 00:07:50,429 --> 00:07:53,473 - Stewart was one of the brightest students I ever had 148 00:07:53,515 --> 00:07:56,185 in the biology department working, 149 00:07:56,226 --> 00:07:58,604 as I recall, on tarantulas. 150 00:07:58,645 --> 00:07:59,897 (dramatic upbeat ominous music) 151 00:08:00,063 --> 00:08:03,025 (typewriter clicking) 152 00:08:03,901 --> 00:08:05,944 - [Stewart] So I would go out on a full moon night 153 00:08:05,986 --> 00:08:08,864 and put up a cot and just watch 154 00:08:08,906 --> 00:08:10,407 what tarantulas do all night. 155 00:08:10,449 --> 00:08:12,284 (dramatic gravel rustling) 156 00:08:12,326 --> 00:08:14,995 (mouse squeaking) 157 00:08:15,037 --> 00:08:18,373 What I've learned is that in any ecosystem, 158 00:08:19,666 --> 00:08:22,586 species are evolving in relation to other species 159 00:08:22,628 --> 00:08:24,755 who are evolving right back at them. 160 00:08:24,796 --> 00:08:25,881 (birds chirping) 161 00:08:25,923 --> 00:08:28,342 And if you apply it to the extinction, 162 00:08:28,383 --> 00:08:30,177 (dove cooing) 163 00:08:30,219 --> 00:08:32,721 there's a new kind of problem for humanity. 164 00:08:33,931 --> 00:08:36,475 (lion roaring) 165 00:08:38,769 --> 00:08:40,020 - Let's put it this way, 166 00:08:40,062 --> 00:08:41,980 if you have a very complex, 167 00:08:42,022 --> 00:08:47,027 evolving planet on which your life absolutely depends, 168 00:08:47,277 --> 00:08:49,863 taking pieces out of it at random is, 169 00:08:49,905 --> 00:08:51,990 by definition, a bad idea. 170 00:08:54,701 --> 00:08:58,330 - We have the power to destroy life on this planet, 171 00:08:58,372 --> 00:09:01,959 which we unfortunately are going about at warp speed. 172 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:05,254 And we are now looking at the extinction of species 173 00:09:05,295 --> 00:09:08,548 at a rate faster than when the dinosaurs went extinct. 174 00:09:08,590 --> 00:09:10,384 (hen clucking) 175 00:09:10,425 --> 00:09:13,262 (birds chirping) 176 00:09:16,598 --> 00:09:19,309 - The American chestnut is one of the prime examples 177 00:09:19,351 --> 00:09:21,979 of a species that is so consequential 178 00:09:22,020 --> 00:09:24,398 in terms of the whole ecosystem that if 179 00:09:24,439 --> 00:09:27,734 that species is gone the whole ecosystem has changed. 180 00:09:29,653 --> 00:09:31,863 One quarter of all the trees in the Eastern forest 181 00:09:31,905 --> 00:09:35,701 of the United States used to be American chestnut trees. 182 00:09:38,412 --> 00:09:41,665 Around 1905, this fungus came in, 183 00:09:41,707 --> 00:09:43,165 apparently from Asia, 184 00:09:43,208 --> 00:09:45,252 killed the trees and they were all gone 185 00:09:45,294 --> 00:09:47,087 within about 20 years. 186 00:09:47,129 --> 00:09:48,922 (dramatic ominous music) 187 00:09:48,964 --> 00:09:49,881 It was huge. 188 00:09:49,923 --> 00:09:52,509 It's called the Redwood of the East. 189 00:09:52,551 --> 00:09:55,470 It was an enormously loved species in North America. 190 00:09:56,722 --> 00:09:59,308 They put down these incredibly sweet nuts 191 00:09:59,349 --> 00:10:01,768 in vast quantities every year. 192 00:10:01,810 --> 00:10:04,980 And it fed a lot of humans and a whole lot 193 00:10:05,147 --> 00:10:07,941 of animals depended on that food source. 194 00:10:07,983 --> 00:10:09,776 And when that food source went away, 195 00:10:09,818 --> 00:10:11,194 the animals went away. 196 00:10:11,236 --> 00:10:13,655 (leaver rumbling) 197 00:10:13,697 --> 00:10:16,533 (doors clicking) 198 00:10:17,367 --> 00:10:19,494 Hi sweeties, there they are. 199 00:10:19,619 --> 00:10:20,746 (drawer rumbling) 200 00:10:20,787 --> 00:10:22,706 (Stewart groaning) 201 00:10:22,748 --> 00:10:23,582 God. 202 00:10:25,792 --> 00:10:28,837 The passenger pigeon was once one of the wonders 203 00:10:28,879 --> 00:10:30,297 of North America. 204 00:10:30,339 --> 00:10:33,759 (pigeons cooing) 205 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:37,637 Visitors from Europe were wowed by Niagara Falls, 206 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:41,266 but they were even more wowed by these incredibly large 207 00:10:41,308 --> 00:10:45,187 and beautiful flocks of passenger pigeons streaming overhead 208 00:10:45,228 --> 00:10:46,980 for days at 60 miles an hour. 209 00:10:47,147 --> 00:10:49,816 (gunshot exploding) 210 00:10:49,983 --> 00:10:52,235 They were a forest bird and they ran out of forest 211 00:10:52,277 --> 00:10:54,029 as well as being hunted to death. 212 00:10:54,071 --> 00:10:57,074 (gunshot exploding) 213 00:10:59,284 --> 00:11:02,037 My mother grew up in the living memory 214 00:11:02,079 --> 00:11:05,499 of what it was like to have the most abundant animal 215 00:11:05,540 --> 00:11:10,379 in America disappear in a period of about three decades. 216 00:11:10,420 --> 00:11:13,173 And she said when the last one died in 1914, 217 00:11:13,340 --> 00:11:15,217 it broke America's heart. 218 00:11:15,258 --> 00:11:16,968 (clock chiming) 219 00:11:17,010 --> 00:11:19,596 (clock ticking) 220 00:11:22,849 --> 00:11:26,478 But that's a tragedy that can be unwritten. 221 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:28,814 You can actually go back to the end of the play and say, 222 00:11:28,855 --> 00:11:30,273 that's not the end of the play, 223 00:11:32,150 --> 00:11:34,277 because we didn't kill their DNA. 224 00:11:36,822 --> 00:11:40,075 Using a closely-related living species, 225 00:11:40,117 --> 00:11:44,204 we can edit the missing genes into the living species 226 00:11:44,246 --> 00:11:48,083 and basically recreate the extinct species. 227 00:11:50,669 --> 00:11:52,879 And we're moving in the direction of bringing 228 00:11:52,921 --> 00:11:55,632 back passenger pigeons and wooly mammoths. 229 00:11:55,674 --> 00:11:57,259 (birds chirping) 230 00:11:57,300 --> 00:11:59,803 I started to get a sense of where it was going 231 00:11:59,845 --> 00:12:02,139 from George Church at Harvard, 232 00:12:02,305 --> 00:12:05,225 one of the leading geniuses in biotech. 233 00:12:05,267 --> 00:12:07,978 - [Reporter] George Church, a world leading geneticist 234 00:12:08,145 --> 00:12:11,982 whose DNA harbors genes for genius. 235 00:12:12,023 --> 00:12:15,360 - [Stewart] He's totally adored by the media. 236 00:12:15,402 --> 00:12:16,695 - George Church, everyone. 237 00:12:16,736 --> 00:12:18,488 (audience applauding) 238 00:12:18,530 --> 00:12:19,906 Bring back the wooly mammoth. 239 00:12:20,073 --> 00:12:21,992 Can we get one? - Yeah. 240 00:12:22,033 --> 00:12:23,869 (audience laughing) 241 00:12:23,910 --> 00:12:27,038 - Tonight's topic is de-extinction. 242 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:30,459 Oh my Gosh, de-extinction. 243 00:12:30,500 --> 00:12:33,503 George, what's the next creature that's gonna crawl 244 00:12:33,545 --> 00:12:34,212 out of your lab? 245 00:12:36,173 --> 00:12:39,801 - So one that's already crawling out are-- 246 00:12:39,843 --> 00:12:41,094 - I was just joking. 247 00:12:41,136 --> 00:12:44,014 (people laughing) 248 00:12:44,055 --> 00:12:47,726 Okay, so you have a real answer to that question? 249 00:12:47,767 --> 00:12:50,187 When you're creating new species, 250 00:12:50,228 --> 00:12:53,106 have you really thought it through? 251 00:12:53,148 --> 00:12:55,817 Because if you haven't then you're dangerous. 252 00:12:55,859 --> 00:12:57,527 - I'm definitely dangerous. - Okay, got that. 253 00:12:57,569 --> 00:12:58,612 Okay, that answers that. 254 00:12:59,696 --> 00:13:01,156 (people laughing) 255 00:13:01,198 --> 00:13:03,783 (upbeat music) 256 00:13:07,204 --> 00:13:09,748 - This is the room where we did all the pig cloning 257 00:13:11,791 --> 00:13:14,794 where we were eliminating viruses from their genome. 258 00:13:14,836 --> 00:13:16,922 - Why its own room? - Why? 259 00:13:16,963 --> 00:13:18,131 - Why has its own room? 260 00:13:18,173 --> 00:13:20,759 It's extra clean? - Well, it's very clean. 261 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:23,553 I tend not to go in these rooms because most 262 00:13:23,595 --> 00:13:25,847 of the human cell we use are from my body. 263 00:13:25,889 --> 00:13:30,101 And many of them are transformed with potential carcinogens. 264 00:13:30,143 --> 00:13:31,311 (Stewart chuckling) 265 00:13:31,353 --> 00:13:33,021 - What? Wait. 266 00:13:34,022 --> 00:13:35,899 You're not worried about your cells getting into there, 267 00:13:35,941 --> 00:13:36,983 you're worried about those cells 268 00:13:37,025 --> 00:13:38,485 getting into you? - Getting into me, yeah right. 269 00:13:38,527 --> 00:13:39,778 - And doing what? - I'm not worried about it 270 00:13:39,819 --> 00:13:41,738 but the lab is, yeah. 271 00:13:43,031 --> 00:13:45,617 Good questions, you're hired. 272 00:13:45,659 --> 00:13:48,620 (Stewart chuckling) 273 00:13:48,662 --> 00:13:50,247 (relaxing ominous music) 274 00:13:50,288 --> 00:13:52,457 - [Stewart] The plausibility of de-extinction, 275 00:13:52,499 --> 00:13:57,295 George Church's lab is really where it all began. 276 00:13:57,337 --> 00:13:59,214 And George started with wooly mammoth. 277 00:14:02,175 --> 00:14:06,012 - The mammoth was a keystone species in the Arctic. 278 00:14:07,097 --> 00:14:09,641 20,000 years ago our ancestors 279 00:14:09,683 --> 00:14:11,977 started systematically slaughtering mammoths. 280 00:14:12,936 --> 00:14:14,729 They were altogether too easy to get 281 00:14:14,896 --> 00:14:18,149 with our new technical abilities. 282 00:14:18,191 --> 00:14:19,234 And the new tools we had 283 00:14:19,276 --> 00:14:22,028 for killing off the herbivores included knives 284 00:14:22,070 --> 00:14:24,322 and spears and fire. 285 00:14:24,364 --> 00:14:25,657 (mammoth trumpeting) 286 00:14:25,699 --> 00:14:28,618 They had strategies for surrounding them 287 00:14:28,660 --> 00:14:31,162 and running them off of cliffs. 288 00:14:31,204 --> 00:14:32,205 (eagle screeching) 289 00:14:32,247 --> 00:14:33,707 (hunters shouting) 290 00:14:33,748 --> 00:14:37,961 Those mistakes, the people who made them did them innocently 291 00:14:38,003 --> 00:14:40,380 and aren't around to take responsibility for them. 292 00:14:40,422 --> 00:14:41,881 We need to take responsibility. 293 00:14:42,007 --> 00:14:44,134 (plastic rustling) 294 00:14:44,175 --> 00:14:45,635 And now we're in a position 295 00:14:45,677 --> 00:14:48,179 where we could reverse those mistakes 296 00:14:49,556 --> 00:14:52,225 with better tools than our ancestors had. 297 00:14:53,893 --> 00:14:55,812 - So this is mammoth tissue. 298 00:14:56,813 --> 00:14:57,647 - Right. 299 00:14:57,814 --> 00:14:58,440 - Can you see 300 00:14:58,481 --> 00:14:59,733 the small tissue? - Yeah. 301 00:14:59,774 --> 00:15:02,777 - Since Asian elephants and wooly mammoths are so similar 302 00:15:02,819 --> 00:15:04,821 to each other, 99.6% similar, 303 00:15:04,863 --> 00:15:07,699 we are hoping to test them first in elephant tissue 304 00:15:07,741 --> 00:15:09,284 and then see whether they work. 305 00:15:10,410 --> 00:15:12,954 (birds chirping) 306 00:15:12,996 --> 00:15:16,499 - What we're doing at Harvard is editing the genes 307 00:15:16,541 --> 00:15:19,002 that bridge the small gap between mammoths 308 00:15:19,169 --> 00:15:21,504 and modern Asian elephants 309 00:15:21,546 --> 00:15:23,923 so that they can be cold resistant. 310 00:15:23,965 --> 00:15:26,343 (mammoth trumpeting) 311 00:15:26,384 --> 00:15:29,512 (audience applauding) 312 00:15:30,889 --> 00:15:32,057 - I am Stewart Brand. 313 00:15:32,098 --> 00:15:35,935 This is the first public discussion of the possibility 314 00:15:35,977 --> 00:15:37,979 of bringing back extinct species. 315 00:15:38,021 --> 00:15:40,106 What's different and what's the same 316 00:15:40,148 --> 00:15:41,566 about the kind of hybridization-- 317 00:15:41,608 --> 00:15:45,070 - Stewart brought us together in the de-extinction movement 318 00:15:45,111 --> 00:15:47,489 and in the same sense that you say, 319 00:15:47,530 --> 00:15:48,782 this is the Manhattan Project, 320 00:15:48,948 --> 00:15:50,158 this is the Apollo Project, 321 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:51,826 this is the Human Genome Project. 322 00:15:52,911 --> 00:15:53,953 That's the sort of thing 323 00:15:53,995 --> 00:15:56,581 that Stewart has brought to de-extinction. 324 00:15:56,623 --> 00:15:58,333 - The century of work that'll go in 325 00:15:58,375 --> 00:16:00,293 to making this a reality. 326 00:16:01,836 --> 00:16:05,674 These engineered mammoth-elephant hybrids will initially go 327 00:16:05,715 --> 00:16:08,802 to Pleistocene Park in Northern Siberia. 328 00:16:08,843 --> 00:16:13,306 (relaxing upbeat instrumental music) 329 00:16:16,017 --> 00:16:19,062 We collaborate with these Russian conservationists, 330 00:16:19,938 --> 00:16:22,607 Sergey Zimov and his son, Nikita Zimov. 331 00:16:24,442 --> 00:16:27,737 (ice jet skis humming) 332 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:32,450 They're returning a variety of herbivores needed 333 00:16:32,492 --> 00:16:34,327 for this particular ecosystem. 334 00:16:34,494 --> 00:16:35,578 (bison bleating) 335 00:16:35,620 --> 00:16:36,579 The only one they're missing 336 00:16:36,621 --> 00:16:38,581 is this mammoth-elephant hybrid. 337 00:16:39,374 --> 00:16:42,293 That's our job to provide one of those. 338 00:16:44,295 --> 00:16:48,341 - It turns out that by bringing back the wooly mammoth, 339 00:16:48,383 --> 00:16:50,510 we can help fix climate change. 340 00:16:51,886 --> 00:16:54,055 The exaggerated version is that we need 341 00:16:54,097 --> 00:16:55,265 to bring back wooly mammoths 342 00:16:55,306 --> 00:16:57,225 because they will save the world. 343 00:16:57,267 --> 00:16:58,643 (audience applauding) 344 00:16:58,685 --> 00:17:01,438 (relaxing upbeat instrumental music) 345 00:17:01,479 --> 00:17:03,273 - I think steward likes the idea, 346 00:17:03,314 --> 00:17:04,148 as do I, 347 00:17:04,315 --> 00:17:08,944 of being able to recreate extinct animals from DNA. 348 00:17:09,820 --> 00:17:11,698 But one of the things that I've learned 349 00:17:11,740 --> 00:17:14,409 in my much longer life than Stewart has had 350 00:17:14,451 --> 00:17:18,163 is that when you pull a technological rabbit out of a hat, 351 00:17:18,204 --> 00:17:20,832 it very often has very nasty droppings. 352 00:17:23,460 --> 00:17:25,336 - I would love to see a mammoth. 353 00:17:25,377 --> 00:17:26,796 Wouldn't that be cool. 354 00:17:27,714 --> 00:17:28,798 That, we can do it, 355 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:31,885 is so much fun and so fascinating for people 356 00:17:31,926 --> 00:17:33,303 who love technology. 357 00:17:34,262 --> 00:17:36,473 At the same time we ought to be asking, 358 00:17:36,514 --> 00:17:37,599 should we do this? 359 00:17:38,558 --> 00:17:40,393 Is this a good idea? 360 00:17:40,435 --> 00:17:44,063 (dramatic ominous music) 361 00:17:44,105 --> 00:17:46,858 (birds chirping) 362 00:17:51,946 --> 00:17:54,741 (gate latch clicking) 363 00:17:54,783 --> 00:17:58,912 (boots banging on wooden steps) 364 00:17:59,078 --> 00:18:00,205 - So what you've got here 365 00:18:01,706 --> 00:18:04,709 is kind of a place where my stuff lives 366 00:18:04,751 --> 00:18:06,503 and also my entire past, 367 00:18:06,544 --> 00:18:08,171 come to think of it. 368 00:18:09,339 --> 00:18:11,090 And then we go into 369 00:18:11,132 --> 00:18:13,718 ♪ The archive. ♪ 370 00:18:15,970 --> 00:18:20,683 Films and slides from my older multimedia shows back 371 00:18:20,725 --> 00:18:22,101 in the '60s. 372 00:18:23,770 --> 00:18:26,105 Photographs, I was a professional photographer 373 00:18:26,147 --> 00:18:28,066 for years in the 374 00:18:28,942 --> 00:18:30,610 '60s and into the '70s. 375 00:18:30,652 --> 00:18:32,445 (camera shutter clicking) 376 00:18:32,487 --> 00:18:33,696 (relaxing chiming music) 377 00:18:33,863 --> 00:18:37,242 (camera shutter clicking) 378 00:18:37,283 --> 00:18:39,035 I graduated early '60s. 379 00:18:39,953 --> 00:18:44,749 An old family friend commissioned me to photograph a tribe 380 00:18:44,791 --> 00:18:46,459 of Indians in Oregon. 381 00:18:46,501 --> 00:18:50,088 (camera shutter clicking) 382 00:18:51,214 --> 00:18:53,800 I had no idea about what Contemporary Indians did 383 00:18:53,842 --> 00:18:54,968 and how they lived. 384 00:18:56,135 --> 00:18:58,972 (horses neighing) 385 00:19:01,057 --> 00:19:02,684 (relaxing chiming music) 386 00:19:02,725 --> 00:19:04,644 (camera shutter clicking) 387 00:19:04,686 --> 00:19:06,604 So the photographs I took, 388 00:19:06,771 --> 00:19:09,315 (camera shutter clicking) 389 00:19:09,357 --> 00:19:11,192 for me, there were revelatory. 390 00:19:12,151 --> 00:19:14,487 (camera shutter clicking) 391 00:19:14,529 --> 00:19:16,489 - The first time I met Stewart Brand was 392 00:19:16,531 --> 00:19:18,825 at the National Congress of American Indians 393 00:19:18,867 --> 00:19:20,869 in Sheridan, Wyoming. 394 00:19:20,910 --> 00:19:22,954 (screeching microphone feedback) 395 00:19:22,996 --> 00:19:25,540 I was working on the registration desk 396 00:19:26,916 --> 00:19:28,668 and he came through the door 397 00:19:28,835 --> 00:19:30,795 (camera shutter clicking) with his camera. 398 00:19:32,589 --> 00:19:33,798 He was very blonde, 399 00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:34,716 didn't fit in. 400 00:19:34,757 --> 00:19:36,759 (Lois chuckling) 401 00:19:36,801 --> 00:19:39,095 He was very much out of place. 402 00:19:40,179 --> 00:19:42,640 (camera shutter clicking) 403 00:19:42,682 --> 00:19:44,559 (relaxing guitar music) 404 00:19:44,601 --> 00:19:47,186 - [Stewart] We went from friends 405 00:19:47,228 --> 00:19:48,771 to absolutely in love 406 00:19:51,149 --> 00:19:53,818 and she became Lois Jennings Brand. 407 00:19:57,488 --> 00:19:58,573 - [Lois] Stewart didn't want 408 00:19:58,615 --> 00:20:03,411 to be encumbered by anything like a lease in an apartment. 409 00:20:04,662 --> 00:20:06,873 So we purchased a trailer, 410 00:20:07,999 --> 00:20:09,876 put all of our belongings, 411 00:20:09,918 --> 00:20:14,047 which in his case involved photographic equipment 412 00:20:14,088 --> 00:20:16,090 and a ton of books. 413 00:20:18,384 --> 00:20:21,179 (birds chirping) 414 00:20:24,641 --> 00:20:26,225 - [Stewart] We moved to San Francisco 415 00:20:26,392 --> 00:20:29,103 and I started to immerse myself 416 00:20:29,228 --> 00:20:33,024 in the Bohemian life of the slightly post Beatnik period 417 00:20:33,066 --> 00:20:35,652 that was happening by the early '60s. 418 00:20:40,198 --> 00:20:41,908 That was when I met Ken Kesey. 419 00:20:44,410 --> 00:20:46,621 His book, "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest", 420 00:20:46,663 --> 00:20:48,790 had a Indian protagonist. 421 00:20:48,957 --> 00:20:53,086 (upbeat percussion music) 422 00:20:53,127 --> 00:20:56,005 (man shouting) (glass shattering) 423 00:20:56,047 --> 00:20:58,675 They sent the photographs to Kesey and word got back, 424 00:20:58,716 --> 00:20:59,884 we'll, come on down. 425 00:21:01,135 --> 00:21:03,721 - [Lois] The first time that Stewart met Kesey, 426 00:21:03,763 --> 00:21:07,225 we drove down to a little tree house. 427 00:21:07,266 --> 00:21:09,227 - Somebody by the door said, welcome, 428 00:21:09,268 --> 00:21:10,645 you must be Stewart. 429 00:21:10,687 --> 00:21:14,315 And that was not usually how you met strangers 430 00:21:14,357 --> 00:21:15,441 in those days. 431 00:21:15,483 --> 00:21:18,069 Usually marijuana was smoked in the bathroom right next 432 00:21:18,111 --> 00:21:20,446 to the toilet so you can flush it down. 433 00:21:20,488 --> 00:21:22,949 So right away I saw the Prankster and boldness. 434 00:21:25,410 --> 00:21:28,037 - The Merry Pranksters were a very interesting collection 435 00:21:28,079 --> 00:21:31,332 of young, footloose folk. 436 00:21:31,374 --> 00:21:35,878 And Ken Kesey was kind of the boss of the outfit. 437 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,297 (dramatic upbeat percussion music) 438 00:21:38,339 --> 00:21:42,427 When Stewart started coming to Prankster events, 439 00:21:42,468 --> 00:21:44,429 pretty soon, he's sporting a top hat. 440 00:21:44,470 --> 00:21:45,513 - Aware of your their own bodies, 441 00:21:45,555 --> 00:21:46,973 their own senses, their breathing, 442 00:21:47,015 --> 00:21:48,933 where they're at and who they're with. 443 00:21:50,727 --> 00:21:54,105 - He's beginning to manifest signs of straying 444 00:21:54,147 --> 00:21:56,315 from the norm in a really good way. 445 00:21:56,357 --> 00:21:57,567 (Carolyn chuckling) 446 00:21:57,608 --> 00:22:01,029 (relaxing upbeat music) 447 00:22:01,988 --> 00:22:04,198 - [Stewart] Civilization was in question. 448 00:22:06,701 --> 00:22:09,328 (protestors chanting) 449 00:22:09,370 --> 00:22:12,123 The civil rights and Vietnam War resistance. 450 00:22:13,291 --> 00:22:15,251 We felt like an all out generation. 451 00:22:17,128 --> 00:22:18,171 (static hissing) 452 00:22:18,212 --> 00:22:19,630 (people chatting) 453 00:22:19,672 --> 00:22:21,632 LSD was a right of passage. 454 00:22:25,428 --> 00:22:29,057 We took apart the trappings of orderly mind 455 00:22:29,098 --> 00:22:30,725 and good education. 456 00:22:30,767 --> 00:22:33,519 (relaxing ominous music) 457 00:22:33,561 --> 00:22:36,564 (sparklers fizzing) 458 00:22:37,899 --> 00:22:40,068 (vehicle horns honking) 459 00:22:40,109 --> 00:22:45,114 And LSD gave us permission to try things in unapproved ways. 460 00:22:47,658 --> 00:22:50,661 (Stewart chuckling) 461 00:22:52,538 --> 00:22:57,293 And that also probably added to our creativity in the sense 462 00:22:57,335 --> 00:23:00,922 that we weren't trying to make it in the lawful world. 463 00:23:02,632 --> 00:23:05,218 We were making it in the world that we felt was partly 464 00:23:05,259 --> 00:23:06,886 of our own creation. 465 00:23:07,053 --> 00:23:09,889 (electric buzzing) 466 00:23:11,974 --> 00:23:14,310 The best thing I learned from their Pranksters, 467 00:23:14,352 --> 00:23:18,523 and this came straight from Kesey, was fearlessness. 468 00:23:18,564 --> 00:23:20,066 (people cheering) 469 00:23:20,108 --> 00:23:24,862 And one of the mottos of the Pranksters was, go further. 470 00:23:24,904 --> 00:23:25,905 (people clapping) 471 00:23:25,947 --> 00:23:26,948 (vehicle horn honking) 472 00:23:26,989 --> 00:23:28,741 (bus rumbling) 473 00:23:28,783 --> 00:23:31,452 - Original Prankster credo, 474 00:23:31,494 --> 00:23:32,370 you start off by saying, 475 00:23:32,537 --> 00:23:33,871 never trust a Prankster, 476 00:23:34,789 --> 00:23:37,250 because I will eventually lie 477 00:23:37,291 --> 00:23:39,335 to you even though I may not want to. 478 00:23:39,377 --> 00:23:40,920 If I say one thing today, (horn blowing) 479 00:23:40,962 --> 00:23:42,296 it may not work tomorrow. 480 00:23:42,338 --> 00:23:44,924 - [Interviewer] Go ahead, Would you repeat that again? 481 00:23:44,966 --> 00:23:46,551 (Kesey imitating horn blowing) 482 00:23:46,592 --> 00:23:49,137 (men laughing) 483 00:23:49,303 --> 00:23:52,557 (camera shutter clicking) 484 00:23:52,598 --> 00:23:55,268 - [Stewart] Kesey was a charismatic leader 485 00:23:55,309 --> 00:23:57,937 and it puts you in the position of paying close attention 486 00:23:57,979 --> 00:23:58,813 to this person. 487 00:23:59,689 --> 00:24:01,524 And then what happens is 488 00:24:01,566 --> 00:24:05,570 that the charismatic character is writing the story 489 00:24:05,611 --> 00:24:07,697 that everybody is participating in. 490 00:24:09,991 --> 00:24:13,369 And you're left having not written your own story 491 00:24:13,411 --> 00:24:14,912 for a while. 492 00:24:14,954 --> 00:24:16,038 (camera shutter clicking) 493 00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:18,166 I happened to me to a little extent. 494 00:24:19,250 --> 00:24:22,336 And I wanted to check in on who am I? 495 00:24:22,378 --> 00:24:23,171 Who do I wanna be? 496 00:24:23,212 --> 00:24:24,463 What do I wanna be doing? 497 00:24:26,215 --> 00:24:29,010 So for my final role in the Merry Pranksters, 498 00:24:30,344 --> 00:24:33,097 I wanted to plan one last big event. 499 00:24:34,140 --> 00:24:35,141 (electric buzzing) 500 00:24:35,183 --> 00:24:36,225 (upbeat drum music) 501 00:24:36,267 --> 00:24:37,059 - [Carolyn] One of the things 502 00:24:37,101 --> 00:24:39,854 that we did was events called The Acid Test. 503 00:24:40,730 --> 00:24:42,398 (people whistling) 504 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,151 We had music and projections. 505 00:24:47,028 --> 00:24:49,780 All of this is audience participation 506 00:24:49,822 --> 00:24:53,367 which was not really done in those days. 507 00:24:53,534 --> 00:24:56,579 It was a costume party like you've never seen before. 508 00:24:57,747 --> 00:25:01,584 because of the additional energy from the LSD. 509 00:25:03,794 --> 00:25:05,963 - [Stewart] I started to organize this thing 510 00:25:06,964 --> 00:25:10,509 and that was the most important of all acid tests, 511 00:25:11,427 --> 00:25:14,263 and we called it the Trips Festival. 512 00:25:16,933 --> 00:25:19,268 - When Stewart was doing all the work 513 00:25:19,310 --> 00:25:22,855 for the Trips Festival he made up a poster. 514 00:25:24,065 --> 00:25:26,901 He put the names of bands on there 515 00:25:26,943 --> 00:25:28,819 that he would like to attend. 516 00:25:28,945 --> 00:25:30,279 And, in fact, 517 00:25:30,321 --> 00:25:33,032 they showed up because they saw the posters and said, 518 00:25:33,074 --> 00:25:34,867 oh, we're supposed to be there. 519 00:25:34,909 --> 00:25:37,245 - [Announcer] Good evening from Captain Consciousness. 520 00:25:37,286 --> 00:25:38,537 For your listening pleasure, 521 00:25:38,704 --> 00:25:40,039 the Grateful Dead. 522 00:25:40,998 --> 00:25:43,334 - [Stewart] Indeed, they did show up and thousands 523 00:25:43,376 --> 00:25:46,504 and thousands of hippies showed up and Tom Wolfe was right 524 00:25:46,545 --> 00:25:49,715 because this is the night (indistinct) was born. 525 00:25:53,052 --> 00:25:55,513 There was a big bucket of ice cream going around 526 00:25:55,554 --> 00:25:56,847 that was laced with LSD. 527 00:25:56,889 --> 00:25:58,766 And it was gonna taste delicious when you ate it 528 00:25:58,933 --> 00:26:00,601 and then it was gonna 529 00:26:00,643 --> 00:26:03,145 become very strange 1/2 an hour later. 530 00:26:03,980 --> 00:26:07,400 What really took off was Grateful Dead 531 00:26:07,441 --> 00:26:10,820 who had just named themselves that and they got on stage 532 00:26:10,861 --> 00:26:13,197 and they were sensational. 533 00:26:13,239 --> 00:26:15,783 - [Carolyn] Stewart invited every weirdo in the Bay Area 534 00:26:15,825 --> 00:26:18,369 that had gadgets to come and set up their stuff. 535 00:26:19,829 --> 00:26:21,664 - [Stewart] We were projecting various things on the walls 536 00:26:21,706 --> 00:26:23,708 and Ken Kesey is writing messages. 537 00:26:25,084 --> 00:26:27,128 - I spent much of the Trips Festival 538 00:26:27,169 --> 00:26:31,007 under a table with a stripper that I was going out with, 539 00:26:31,048 --> 00:26:32,925 high on acid. 540 00:26:32,967 --> 00:26:36,262 It would be hard for me to tell you much more than that. 541 00:26:36,304 --> 00:26:38,889 It was maybe my first experience of being high 542 00:26:38,931 --> 00:26:41,350 with lots and lots of people. 543 00:26:41,392 --> 00:26:42,893 - People are not dancing with each other, 544 00:26:43,019 --> 00:26:46,230 they're dancing with everybody and looking around 545 00:26:46,272 --> 00:26:49,525 and clotsing into things and doing stuff to the beat 546 00:26:49,567 --> 00:26:50,943 that everybody is on. 547 00:26:52,945 --> 00:26:55,948 Typically, at a party wherever there was a strobe, 548 00:26:55,990 --> 00:26:57,491 people would just get under it and then. 549 00:26:57,533 --> 00:26:59,618 (Stewart clicking tongue) 550 00:26:59,660 --> 00:27:01,203 That was another thing that got people moving 551 00:27:01,245 --> 00:27:04,081 'cause they loved watching pieces 552 00:27:04,123 --> 00:27:05,708 of themselves flying around. 553 00:27:08,586 --> 00:27:11,088 - [Peter] The Trips Festival was a watershed moment 554 00:27:11,130 --> 00:27:13,424 that introduced a lot of different communities 555 00:27:13,466 --> 00:27:15,343 and families to one another. 556 00:27:15,384 --> 00:27:17,428 We could recognize each other and knew 557 00:27:17,470 --> 00:27:19,138 that we were on the same page. 558 00:27:20,222 --> 00:27:22,224 - Thousands of hippies in the Bay Area discovered 559 00:27:22,391 --> 00:27:24,852 that there were thousands of hippies in the Bay Area. 560 00:27:24,894 --> 00:27:27,438 And that let's you know there's a movement. 561 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:30,483 (upbeat drum music) 562 00:27:34,195 --> 00:27:37,365 Trips Festival was a very true for me in the sense 563 00:27:37,406 --> 00:27:40,201 of I just made a riot happen. 564 00:27:40,242 --> 00:27:42,828 But on the other hand, nothing's changed. 565 00:27:42,870 --> 00:27:44,622 Yeah, that was a great event, 566 00:27:44,663 --> 00:27:45,664 meanwhile, now what? 567 00:27:46,665 --> 00:27:49,418 (clock ticking) 568 00:27:51,045 --> 00:27:52,588 So two months later, 569 00:27:52,755 --> 00:27:56,217 it's a tedious afternoon and maybe I'll just take, 570 00:27:56,258 --> 00:27:57,051 I don't know, 571 00:27:57,093 --> 00:28:00,054 100 micrograms or something and go up on the roof 572 00:28:00,096 --> 00:28:02,598 and see what LSD does for the afternoon. 573 00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:05,643 (Stewart chuckling) 574 00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:09,438 And as I'm looking out at San Francisco, 575 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:14,360 I imagine that the buildings that are parallel Downtown 576 00:28:14,402 --> 00:28:15,444 are not quite parallel, 577 00:28:15,486 --> 00:28:18,697 they're actually slightly diverge because they're 578 00:28:18,739 --> 00:28:20,950 on the curved surface of the Earth. 579 00:28:20,991 --> 00:28:23,452 (dramatic ominous music) 580 00:28:23,494 --> 00:28:25,371 (man speaking in foreign language) 581 00:28:25,413 --> 00:28:28,124 At this point we're 10 years into Sputnik 582 00:28:28,165 --> 00:28:31,627 and there's been no photographs of the Earth as a whole. 583 00:28:31,794 --> 00:28:34,296 LSD is not actually consciousness expanding, 584 00:28:34,338 --> 00:28:36,257 it's consciousness concentrating. 585 00:28:36,298 --> 00:28:37,675 And so you get thinking about one thing 586 00:28:37,716 --> 00:28:40,428 and that's all you can think about for hours. 587 00:28:40,469 --> 00:28:42,680 So all I could think about on that rooftop was 588 00:28:42,721 --> 00:28:43,889 how different everything would be 589 00:28:44,056 --> 00:28:46,684 if you could see a photograph of the Earth in space? 590 00:28:46,725 --> 00:28:48,102 (pen grinding on paper) 591 00:28:48,144 --> 00:28:50,855 So what I had conjured in my mind was a button 592 00:28:52,064 --> 00:28:53,149 that would say, 593 00:28:53,190 --> 00:28:56,777 why haven't we seen a photograph of the whole Earth yet? 594 00:28:56,819 --> 00:29:00,281 I sent the button to all of the congressmen, 595 00:29:00,322 --> 00:29:01,657 (typewriter clicking) 596 00:29:01,699 --> 00:29:05,703 to NASA and officials in the Soviet Union 597 00:29:05,744 --> 00:29:08,747 and then started selling them on college campuses. 598 00:29:10,749 --> 00:29:12,001 People would come up and say, 599 00:29:12,042 --> 00:29:13,627 what's this about? 600 00:29:13,669 --> 00:29:17,298 (relaxing twinkling music) 601 00:29:17,339 --> 00:29:19,592 Ever since 1945, 602 00:29:20,509 --> 00:29:24,680 the image of the mushroom cloud made people feel 603 00:29:24,722 --> 00:29:27,183 that civilization was basically doomed. 604 00:29:27,349 --> 00:29:30,436 (atomic bomb rumbling) 605 00:29:33,772 --> 00:29:34,607 (camera shutter clicking) 606 00:29:34,648 --> 00:29:35,608 Being a photographer, 607 00:29:35,649 --> 00:29:39,236 I was thinking about the images that hadn't been made yet 608 00:29:40,112 --> 00:29:42,656 that might change humanity's behavior. 609 00:29:44,116 --> 00:29:45,993 - [Shuttle Launcher] T-minus 10, nine, 610 00:29:46,035 --> 00:29:47,745 eight, seven, 611 00:29:47,786 --> 00:29:48,996 six, 612 00:29:49,163 --> 00:29:50,372 five. 613 00:29:50,414 --> 00:29:54,043 (rocket rumbling) 614 00:29:54,084 --> 00:29:54,919 Liftoff. 615 00:29:59,798 --> 00:30:01,717 - I feel the liftoff, 616 00:30:01,759 --> 00:30:03,969 the clock has started. 617 00:30:04,011 --> 00:30:07,181 I was the Apollo 9 lunar module pilot. 618 00:30:08,432 --> 00:30:10,726 Seeing the earth with your own eyes, 619 00:30:11,685 --> 00:30:16,065 you realize how small and fragile it is 620 00:30:17,733 --> 00:30:20,736 and that all of life is on that planet. 621 00:30:22,905 --> 00:30:24,907 It changes your perspective 622 00:30:25,950 --> 00:30:29,328 and that's basically what Stewart recognized. 623 00:30:33,582 --> 00:30:36,502 - [Stewart] Finally, NASA publicly released 624 00:30:36,544 --> 00:30:39,880 the first ever image of the whole Earth. 625 00:30:39,922 --> 00:30:42,925 (dramatic rumbling) 626 00:30:49,890 --> 00:30:52,017 The whole damn thing was alive, 627 00:30:52,059 --> 00:30:52,893 you could see that. 628 00:30:56,230 --> 00:30:58,399 And it was a hopeful image 629 00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:00,234 and it blew away the mushroom cloud. 630 00:31:02,027 --> 00:31:05,948 - That one image created this extraordinary frame 631 00:31:05,990 --> 00:31:10,995 of reference for our relationships with other cultures 632 00:31:11,078 --> 00:31:12,621 and the planet itself. 633 00:31:13,664 --> 00:31:16,709 - [Stewart] Humanity wasn't just capable 634 00:31:16,750 --> 00:31:17,835 of destroying itself, 635 00:31:17,876 --> 00:31:21,088 humanity was capable of discovering itself 636 00:31:21,130 --> 00:31:23,048 in this very visual way. 637 00:31:25,134 --> 00:31:26,343 - Let's give Stewart credit. 638 00:31:26,385 --> 00:31:30,639 When we could look at the real earth in her photograph 639 00:31:30,681 --> 00:31:32,558 that Stewart kept yelling for, 640 00:31:33,642 --> 00:31:36,770 people were beginning to get this idea that we all live 641 00:31:36,812 --> 00:31:40,608 on a very small planet and that we're not just passengers, 642 00:31:40,649 --> 00:31:43,861 we're the crew and we're responsible for what goes on. 643 00:31:45,738 --> 00:31:49,074 - [Stewart] Indeed, once we did have the photographs, 644 00:31:49,241 --> 00:31:52,661 suddenly there's organizations called Friends of the Earth 645 00:31:52,703 --> 00:31:54,413 and Earth First. 646 00:31:54,455 --> 00:31:56,707 (protestors chanting) 647 00:31:56,749 --> 00:32:00,169 A bunch of environmental organizations took off globally 648 00:32:02,129 --> 00:32:04,673 that were assuming care of this thing 649 00:32:04,715 --> 00:32:08,218 that was now understood to be in need of care. 650 00:32:08,260 --> 00:32:11,639 - The United Nations has assumed responsibility 651 00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:16,518 for the preservation of species in danger of extinction 652 00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:19,730 and whereas the United Nations Conference-- 653 00:32:19,772 --> 00:32:22,358 - I think Stu played a very important role 654 00:32:22,399 --> 00:32:24,818 in creating the environmental movement 655 00:32:26,195 --> 00:32:28,364 and in making it accessible, 656 00:32:28,405 --> 00:32:31,200 showing people that there are different ways to live. 657 00:32:31,241 --> 00:32:34,995 (relaxing upbeat rock music) 658 00:32:47,132 --> 00:32:48,342 - [Stewart] All my friends were involved 659 00:32:48,384 --> 00:32:50,719 in various commune efforts, 660 00:32:50,761 --> 00:32:53,347 basically trying to reinvent civilization. 661 00:32:54,306 --> 00:32:55,933 Most of these communes were being started 662 00:32:55,974 --> 00:32:59,061 by liberal arts majors who had dropped out of college 663 00:32:59,103 --> 00:33:01,438 and their knowledge was not helping them at all. 664 00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:03,774 (water splashing) 665 00:33:03,816 --> 00:33:05,776 By then I had a sense I wanted 666 00:33:05,818 --> 00:33:07,611 to effect change in the world. 667 00:33:07,653 --> 00:33:08,821 Human nature doesn't change. 668 00:33:08,862 --> 00:33:10,447 You're wasting your time if you try to change 669 00:33:10,489 --> 00:33:11,323 how people behave, 670 00:33:11,365 --> 00:33:12,408 but if you can change their tools, 671 00:33:12,449 --> 00:33:14,076 you can change whatever you want. 672 00:33:15,494 --> 00:33:16,829 And I thought, well, 673 00:33:16,870 --> 00:33:19,206 I could maybe have kind of a catalog. 674 00:33:20,124 --> 00:33:24,169 The great thing about being a double (indistinct) artist 675 00:33:24,211 --> 00:33:26,547 is that I didn't have a job. 676 00:33:26,588 --> 00:33:29,049 So if you have an idea and it still seems 677 00:33:29,091 --> 00:33:30,551 like a good idea the next day, 678 00:33:30,592 --> 00:33:32,344 you just start. 679 00:33:32,386 --> 00:33:36,265 And so I'd started the "Whole Earth Catalog" in 1968 680 00:33:37,182 --> 00:33:41,353 and the subtitle was "Access to Tools". 681 00:33:41,395 --> 00:33:44,189 (relaxing upbeat guitar music) 682 00:33:44,231 --> 00:33:46,191 - In all the "Whole Earth Catalogs, 683 00:33:46,233 --> 00:33:48,277 Stewart injected the phrase, 684 00:33:48,318 --> 00:33:51,739 "We are as Gods and might as well get good at it." 685 00:33:53,198 --> 00:33:54,700 - [Stewart] It was an acknowledgement 686 00:33:54,742 --> 00:33:56,243 that there's an empowerment 687 00:33:56,285 --> 00:33:58,579 that has occurred of the individual. 688 00:33:59,621 --> 00:34:04,251 (relaxing upbeat guitar music) 689 00:34:04,293 --> 00:34:05,586 Lois was the COO 690 00:34:07,504 --> 00:34:10,090 and brought a business acumen. 691 00:34:11,091 --> 00:34:16,054 - The first issue I think we only printed a thousand copies. 692 00:34:17,139 --> 00:34:18,974 A number were given away. 693 00:34:20,141 --> 00:34:22,643 It was just a massive disaster. 694 00:34:22,686 --> 00:34:23,562 (Lois chuckling) 695 00:34:23,603 --> 00:34:24,730 He's going, no. 696 00:34:27,858 --> 00:34:29,193 - The first first "Whole Earth Catalog", 697 00:34:29,234 --> 00:34:32,154 we distributed them by carrying them around physically 698 00:34:32,196 --> 00:34:34,239 to bookstores and saying, here. 699 00:34:34,281 --> 00:34:35,908 (Stewart chuckling) 700 00:34:35,949 --> 00:34:36,784 And they would say, 701 00:34:36,824 --> 00:34:38,619 what is it, what section do I put it in? 702 00:34:38,659 --> 00:34:41,330 And we would not know how to answer that. 703 00:34:44,166 --> 00:34:48,587 - You have to understand how impoverished the world was 704 00:34:48,629 --> 00:34:51,590 in terms of information. 705 00:34:51,632 --> 00:34:54,134 If you'd had a question it was very unlikely 706 00:34:54,176 --> 00:34:55,594 that you would ever get an answer to it, 707 00:34:55,636 --> 00:34:57,346 so most people never asked the question. 708 00:34:57,387 --> 00:34:59,848 (relaxing upbeat music) 709 00:34:59,890 --> 00:35:02,518 - These days I'll pop open my handy phone, 710 00:35:02,684 --> 00:35:03,644 go on the internet, 711 00:35:03,685 --> 00:35:08,232 Google it and the world's information is at my fingertips. 712 00:35:09,358 --> 00:35:11,026 When the "Whole Earth Catalog" came out, 713 00:35:11,068 --> 00:35:12,778 this wasn't true. 714 00:35:12,820 --> 00:35:14,196 Where would you go? 715 00:35:15,823 --> 00:35:19,409 - [Man] You could think of it as the web on newsprint, 716 00:35:19,451 --> 00:35:22,454 so it became a catalog of possibilities. 717 00:35:22,496 --> 00:35:26,625 And the startup culture was born directly out 718 00:35:26,667 --> 00:35:28,460 of the "Whole Earth Catalog". 719 00:35:31,380 --> 00:35:33,382 - [Man] Stewart and his team put out several issues 720 00:35:33,423 --> 00:35:35,968 of the "Whole Earth Catalog" and he brought it to life 721 00:35:36,009 --> 00:35:37,469 with his poetic touch. 722 00:35:37,511 --> 00:35:40,097 This was in the late '60s before personal computers 723 00:35:40,138 --> 00:35:41,598 and desktop publishing, 724 00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:43,475 so it was all made with typewriters, 725 00:35:43,517 --> 00:35:45,394 scissors and Polaroid cameras. 726 00:35:45,435 --> 00:35:47,437 It was idealistic, 727 00:35:47,479 --> 00:35:50,399 overflowing with neat tools and great notions. 728 00:35:51,275 --> 00:35:52,442 (hen crowing) 729 00:35:52,484 --> 00:35:54,945 - [Kevin] Millions of people who were reading it 730 00:35:54,987 --> 00:35:57,447 were taught to invent their life. 731 00:35:59,741 --> 00:36:01,910 - Everybody could plug in and chip in 732 00:36:02,077 --> 00:36:04,580 on this conversation about what's the role 733 00:36:04,746 --> 00:36:09,167 of tools and technology in this new imagining of the world? 734 00:36:10,919 --> 00:36:11,920 - For somebody like me, 735 00:36:11,962 --> 00:36:15,048 living in the English countryside at the time, 736 00:36:15,090 --> 00:36:16,550 I thought, oh my God, 737 00:36:16,592 --> 00:36:18,552 there's a lot of others out there too. 738 00:36:19,511 --> 00:36:22,598 And it consolidated in so many people's minds the idea 739 00:36:22,639 --> 00:36:24,850 that there was a new movement, 740 00:36:24,975 --> 00:36:27,895 there was a new consciousness of some kind. 741 00:36:27,936 --> 00:36:31,023 The "Whole Earth Catalog" was a revolution. 742 00:36:31,064 --> 00:36:33,901 (people laughing) 743 00:36:42,868 --> 00:36:45,621 - I had set the "Whole Earth Catalog" 744 00:36:45,662 --> 00:36:49,666 on a path of it had to be bigger, better, 745 00:36:49,833 --> 00:36:51,335 more ambitious, wider reach, 746 00:36:51,376 --> 00:36:52,711 more people involved. 747 00:36:53,712 --> 00:36:56,006 Pretty soon we had a very steep curve 748 00:36:56,173 --> 00:36:59,009 of people subscribing this publication and money coming in, 749 00:36:59,885 --> 00:37:03,013 and it was being a fabulous success in the world. 750 00:37:03,055 --> 00:37:04,306 (upbeat music) 751 00:37:04,348 --> 00:37:06,475 (audience applauding) 752 00:37:06,642 --> 00:37:07,517 - The "Whole Earth Catalog", 753 00:37:07,559 --> 00:37:08,644 it's just full of the kinds of things 754 00:37:08,685 --> 00:37:11,688 that make you wish you had infinite amount of spare time. 755 00:37:11,730 --> 00:37:13,607 Oh, this is an amazing thing. 756 00:37:13,649 --> 00:37:16,276 - [Stewart] It won the National Book Award. 757 00:37:16,318 --> 00:37:17,110 I was getting interviewed. 758 00:37:17,152 --> 00:37:19,780 Why haven't we seen the photograph of the whole Earth yet? 759 00:37:19,947 --> 00:37:20,739 (audience laughing) 760 00:37:20,781 --> 00:37:24,409 So at a fairly young age I was nationally famous. 761 00:37:24,451 --> 00:37:27,788 Plus, we have a flag which is a pretty thing, 762 00:37:27,829 --> 00:37:31,166 the only flag you can say that doesn't exclude anybody out, 763 00:37:31,208 --> 00:37:32,000 everybody's in it. 764 00:37:32,042 --> 00:37:33,669 - That's the Earth from the NASA? 765 00:37:33,710 --> 00:37:37,631 (audience applauding) 766 00:37:37,673 --> 00:37:41,093 - [Man] On the back cover was their farewell message. 767 00:37:41,134 --> 00:37:43,887 "Stay hungry, stay foolish." 768 00:37:49,142 --> 00:37:52,145 (airplane rumbling) 769 00:37:55,607 --> 00:37:58,443 (relaxing music) 770 00:38:01,989 --> 00:38:04,324 - We're going to Pleistocene Park. 771 00:38:11,540 --> 00:38:15,377 In a way what we're doing is bringing two visions together. 772 00:38:17,629 --> 00:38:21,049 One is what George Church is doing at the Harvard lab, 773 00:38:21,091 --> 00:38:23,343 bringing wooly mammoths back to a world, 774 00:38:26,972 --> 00:38:31,977 and the matching vision is to restore the mammoth steppe. 775 00:38:37,274 --> 00:38:40,736 (upbeat percussion music) 776 00:40:01,233 --> 00:40:02,109 (horse neighing) 777 00:40:04,694 --> 00:40:06,780 (relaxing upbeat percussion music) 778 00:40:06,822 --> 00:40:09,991 (horse clip-clopping) 779 00:40:11,201 --> 00:40:14,538 (relaxing ominous music) 780 00:40:15,872 --> 00:40:19,292 (barge humming) 781 00:40:19,334 --> 00:40:22,170 (water trickling) 782 00:40:25,006 --> 00:40:29,261 (man speaking in foreign language) 783 00:40:30,595 --> 00:40:33,723 (boat engine humming) 784 00:40:43,650 --> 00:40:46,736 (water trickling) 785 00:40:46,778 --> 00:40:50,031 (relaxing ominous music) 786 00:40:52,993 --> 00:40:55,453 (crow cawing) 787 00:40:58,915 --> 00:41:02,252 (dry branches clanging) 788 00:41:02,294 --> 00:41:04,629 (mud squishing) 789 00:41:04,671 --> 00:41:06,339 - [Stewart] Come on. 790 00:41:08,675 --> 00:41:09,551 - [Sergey] This is mammoth. 791 00:41:09,593 --> 00:41:13,346 - You figure that's mammoth? - Yeah. 792 00:41:13,388 --> 00:41:15,015 I feel it's the smell of mammoth. 793 00:41:15,056 --> 00:41:17,475 - The smell of mammoth, come on. 794 00:41:17,517 --> 00:41:21,354 - It's finger, hand or finger of mammoth. 795 00:41:22,314 --> 00:41:25,358 - [Stewart] Mammoth bones are just dense in the ground 796 00:41:26,902 --> 00:41:28,486 all across this land. 797 00:41:28,653 --> 00:41:30,197 (flies buzzing) 798 00:41:30,238 --> 00:41:31,865 (crickets chirping) 799 00:41:31,907 --> 00:41:36,494 Sergey Zimov refers to it as once the world's largest biome. 800 00:41:36,536 --> 00:41:40,123 It wrapped all the way across the North of Eurasia 801 00:41:40,165 --> 00:41:43,585 and the north of North America, Canada. 802 00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:47,756 (water splashing) 803 00:41:49,758 --> 00:41:53,053 (boat engine humming) 804 00:41:53,094 --> 00:41:54,137 While we were here, 805 00:41:54,179 --> 00:41:57,849 the story was getting out of the discovery by the Zimovs 806 00:41:57,891 --> 00:42:00,810 of something troubling going on in the permafrost 807 00:42:00,852 --> 00:42:02,646 that they're studying. 808 00:42:02,687 --> 00:42:04,731 (branches cracking) 809 00:42:04,773 --> 00:42:07,609 (birds chirping) 810 00:42:10,111 --> 00:42:12,280 (door creaking) 811 00:42:12,322 --> 00:42:13,490 (door banging) 812 00:42:13,531 --> 00:42:16,493 (door creaking) 813 00:42:16,534 --> 00:42:20,163 (boots banging on wooden steps) 814 00:42:20,205 --> 00:42:22,749 (ice crystals cracking) 815 00:42:33,385 --> 00:42:37,555 (magical crystal twinkling music) 816 00:42:53,697 --> 00:42:55,740 (ice crystals cracking) 817 00:43:06,376 --> 00:43:09,671 (boots crunching on ice) 818 00:43:18,388 --> 00:43:19,848 - This last winter, 819 00:43:19,889 --> 00:43:21,349 a layer of the permafrost 820 00:43:21,391 --> 00:43:24,352 that normally freezes did not freeze, 821 00:43:24,394 --> 00:43:26,646 it stayed thawed. 822 00:43:26,688 --> 00:43:28,398 (dramatic ominous echoing) 823 00:43:34,154 --> 00:43:35,572 (water trickling) 824 00:43:43,788 --> 00:43:45,123 (water trickling) 825 00:44:01,139 --> 00:44:02,974 (frozen ice cracking) 826 00:44:08,229 --> 00:44:10,315 (methane bubbling underwater) 827 00:44:10,357 --> 00:44:13,151 (tree branches creaking) 828 00:44:38,635 --> 00:44:39,636 (water trickling) 829 00:44:39,803 --> 00:44:40,887 (empty plastic container banging) 830 00:44:46,309 --> 00:44:48,603 (water trickling) 831 00:44:48,645 --> 00:44:52,065 (relaxing ominous music) 832 00:45:01,116 --> 00:45:04,536 (match hissing to light) 833 00:45:10,083 --> 00:45:13,461 - What's coming out of that lake is real methane 834 00:45:13,503 --> 00:45:17,382 that's going on apparently all day and all night, all year. 835 00:45:17,424 --> 00:45:19,884 (water trickling) 836 00:45:19,926 --> 00:45:23,179 So we've got a bad feedback cycle going on 837 00:45:23,221 --> 00:45:26,015 which needs to be slowed, stopped, 838 00:45:26,057 --> 00:45:27,434 and ideally, reversed 839 00:45:27,475 --> 00:45:29,561 (water trickling) 840 00:45:29,602 --> 00:45:32,647 (relaxing ominous music) 841 00:45:32,689 --> 00:45:35,733 (birds chirping) 842 00:45:43,116 --> 00:45:44,701 (horses clip-clopping) 843 00:45:49,831 --> 00:45:53,376 - The Sergey Zimov theory is that if you put a dense array 844 00:45:53,418 --> 00:45:55,962 of grazing animals back on this land, 845 00:45:56,004 --> 00:46:00,258 they will turn Tundra and Boreal Forest back into grassland. 846 00:46:01,342 --> 00:46:03,219 And the grassland's gonna stop the release 847 00:46:03,386 --> 00:46:06,639 of greenhouse gasses coming from this thawing permafrost. 848 00:46:08,141 --> 00:46:11,269 (birds chirping) 849 00:46:11,311 --> 00:46:12,353 (moose hooves clip clopping) 850 00:46:12,479 --> 00:46:15,106 Such a great looking animal. 851 00:46:15,148 --> 00:46:16,816 (leaves rustling) 852 00:46:32,707 --> 00:46:34,751 - These animals busily, 853 00:46:34,792 --> 00:46:37,086 almost frantically they're eating. 854 00:46:37,128 --> 00:46:38,796 Chow, chow, chow, munch munch. 855 00:46:40,089 --> 00:46:42,008 These guys are working. 856 00:46:42,050 --> 00:46:45,470 (relaxing ominous music) 857 00:46:47,388 --> 00:46:48,181 In the winter, 858 00:46:49,474 --> 00:46:50,975 in order to get to the grass, 859 00:46:51,017 --> 00:46:53,353 the animals, they're trampling and digging down 860 00:46:53,394 --> 00:46:56,606 through the snow and the cold gets into the ground 861 00:46:56,648 --> 00:46:58,399 and keeps the ground frozen. 862 00:46:58,441 --> 00:47:00,151 (freezing water crystallizing) 863 00:47:00,193 --> 00:47:01,861 - [George] And then the mammoths, 864 00:47:02,695 --> 00:47:04,447 you can do things that cannot be done 865 00:47:04,489 --> 00:47:06,783 by the other herbivores 866 00:47:06,824 --> 00:47:10,453 like knock down trees. (mammoth trumpeting) 867 00:47:10,495 --> 00:47:11,663 - [Stewart] Wow. 868 00:47:11,704 --> 00:47:13,081 (indistinct) 869 00:47:13,122 --> 00:47:13,998 Talk about data. 870 00:47:15,500 --> 00:47:18,461 At Pleistocene Park they've been able to prove 871 00:47:18,628 --> 00:47:21,297 that if you have fairly dense population 872 00:47:21,339 --> 00:47:23,675 of grazing animals on the land, 873 00:47:23,716 --> 00:47:27,720 that leads directly to the ground underneath getting colder 874 00:47:27,845 --> 00:47:29,931 as much as two degrees Celsius. 875 00:47:33,268 --> 00:47:36,813 That amount of coldness can make an enormous difference 876 00:47:36,854 --> 00:47:40,483 in terms of heading off the thawing of the permafrost. 877 00:47:41,484 --> 00:47:45,738 So if you get wooly mammoths back on the landscape, 878 00:47:45,780 --> 00:47:48,825 they will push down the temperature even more. 879 00:47:50,118 --> 00:47:53,955 (freezing water crystallizing) 880 00:47:57,333 --> 00:48:00,295 This whole Pleistocene Park Project is a form 881 00:48:00,461 --> 00:48:05,133 of geoengineering, an attempt to directly affect climate. 882 00:48:06,301 --> 00:48:08,845 And what I love about it is it's the only form 883 00:48:08,886 --> 00:48:10,096 of geoengineering I know 884 00:48:10,138 --> 00:48:12,557 that's not mechanical, it's biological. 885 00:48:14,934 --> 00:48:17,854 We're nudging the ecosystem in the right direction 886 00:48:19,981 --> 00:48:22,483 but nature's doing most of the work. 887 00:48:24,944 --> 00:48:29,032 And then the animals take over and the grass takes over 888 00:48:29,073 --> 00:48:31,451 (moose hooves clip-clopping) 889 00:48:31,492 --> 00:48:33,911 and this landscape comes back to life. 890 00:48:35,872 --> 00:48:39,292 (relaxing chiming music) 891 00:48:42,629 --> 00:48:45,423 - Stewart suggests that with tools 892 00:48:45,465 --> 00:48:49,552 and technology there's a bright future ahead of us, 893 00:48:51,262 --> 00:48:54,682 that we can fix all the disasters that we've created 894 00:48:54,724 --> 00:48:55,600 on our planet. 895 00:48:57,852 --> 00:49:01,522 But I think these experiments are horseshit. 896 00:49:04,025 --> 00:49:05,568 At a certain age you need to know 897 00:49:05,610 --> 00:49:08,863 that everything has a shadow and you need to account for it, 898 00:49:10,073 --> 00:49:14,410 otherwise you run into disastrous unintended consequences. 899 00:49:15,495 --> 00:49:17,580 - Welcome everybody, we are here tonight 900 00:49:17,622 --> 00:49:19,999 to discuss technology. 901 00:49:20,041 --> 00:49:21,918 We can't live without technology, 902 00:49:21,959 --> 00:49:23,252 no one suggests that, 903 00:49:24,170 --> 00:49:26,631 but how do we live with it? 904 00:49:26,673 --> 00:49:27,715 You, Stewart Brand, 905 00:49:27,757 --> 00:49:32,387 say that we should assume that the technology is neutral 906 00:49:32,428 --> 00:49:35,723 and that the people promoting it are neutral. 907 00:49:35,765 --> 00:49:38,267 Why would one assume that those people are neutral? 908 00:49:38,309 --> 00:49:43,314 - There is very little malevolence behind new technologies. 909 00:49:43,940 --> 00:49:45,983 People are trying to figure out how to make a cool, 910 00:49:46,025 --> 00:49:48,569 new tool work in a cool, new way. 911 00:49:48,611 --> 00:49:49,862 - [Mark] Winona LaDuke? 912 00:49:49,904 --> 00:49:51,823 - Technology's not gonna save us. 913 00:49:51,989 --> 00:49:53,616 It is a tool, perhaps, 914 00:49:53,658 --> 00:49:57,245 in part of what we need to do but we need to be responsible. 915 00:49:57,286 --> 00:50:00,248 From my perspective all these questions require 916 00:50:00,289 --> 00:50:03,459 this broader thinking and not an amnesia, 917 00:50:03,501 --> 00:50:05,378 which I think is what you are promoting. 918 00:50:05,420 --> 00:50:06,921 For instance, Edward Teller, 919 00:50:06,963 --> 00:50:09,674 father of the hydrogen bomb is the guy who came up 920 00:50:09,716 --> 00:50:13,594 with the fabulously bad idea of geoengineering. 921 00:50:13,636 --> 00:50:16,556 I don't agree that every new technology is equal 922 00:50:16,597 --> 00:50:20,768 and that everybody comes with clear moral history 923 00:50:20,810 --> 00:50:23,229 and clear conscience. 924 00:50:23,271 --> 00:50:24,105 I don't agree with that 925 00:50:24,147 --> 00:50:26,315 because I don't actually have amnesia. 926 00:50:26,357 --> 00:50:29,527 (audience applauding) 927 00:50:30,653 --> 00:50:32,280 - Hi, Stewart. 928 00:50:32,321 --> 00:50:33,823 - Is that Peter? 929 00:50:33,865 --> 00:50:35,241 - Hi, Winona. - Hi. 930 00:50:36,743 --> 00:50:40,538 - Let me challenge your hypothesis that we're Gods 931 00:50:40,580 --> 00:50:44,125 and let me suggest a more accurate metaphor 932 00:50:44,167 --> 00:50:46,085 which would be idiot savants. 933 00:50:46,127 --> 00:50:47,754 (audience applauding) 934 00:50:47,795 --> 00:50:49,589 We're highly developed. 935 00:50:49,630 --> 00:50:51,924 We have these great skills, 936 00:50:51,966 --> 00:50:54,761 these technological cleverness 937 00:50:54,802 --> 00:50:58,014 which is completely untethered to wisdom. 938 00:50:59,140 --> 00:51:03,102 What I find disturbing and sort of a little sociopathic 939 00:51:03,144 --> 00:51:04,353 about your perspective 940 00:51:07,398 --> 00:51:09,317 is the absence of doubt. 941 00:51:09,358 --> 00:51:12,528 (audience applauding) 942 00:51:18,659 --> 00:51:23,247 - Stu loves technology of almost any variety. 943 00:51:23,289 --> 00:51:27,919 And if you have a big megaphone like Stewart Brand does, 944 00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:32,799 I would hope he would put it on the side of preservation. 945 00:51:33,716 --> 00:51:36,385 - This is a American chestnut tree. 946 00:51:36,427 --> 00:51:37,512 There's some tests to be done-- 947 00:51:37,553 --> 00:51:39,680 - Instead, for reasons that defeat me, 948 00:51:39,722 --> 00:51:41,974 Stu is a fan of genetic modification. 949 00:51:45,728 --> 00:51:47,730 This is human cleverness. 950 00:51:47,772 --> 00:51:49,690 We know better than nature. 951 00:51:50,900 --> 00:51:51,734 Really? 952 00:51:54,487 --> 00:51:56,155 Stu, I'm sorry, 953 00:51:56,197 --> 00:51:58,074 this is not environmentalism. 954 00:52:02,620 --> 00:52:05,456 - The idea that humans are moving genes 955 00:52:05,498 --> 00:52:08,125 from one organism into the genome 956 00:52:08,167 --> 00:52:10,753 of another organism is somehow against nature, 957 00:52:10,795 --> 00:52:12,338 is just dead wrong. 958 00:52:12,380 --> 00:52:13,756 (Stewart chuckling) 959 00:52:13,798 --> 00:52:14,924 (birds chirping) 960 00:52:14,966 --> 00:52:16,467 It's assisted evolution, 961 00:52:18,469 --> 00:52:20,930 and so we're doing exactly what nature does. 962 00:52:22,390 --> 00:52:27,395 This is what killed five billion American chestnut trees. 963 00:52:28,813 --> 00:52:30,898 These trees are functionally extinct 964 00:52:30,940 --> 00:52:32,191 because they can't reproduce 965 00:52:32,233 --> 00:52:34,777 and make a forest like they used to. 966 00:52:34,819 --> 00:52:36,612 But genetically they're not extinct at all, 967 00:52:36,654 --> 00:52:38,906 they've got all the variety they ever had 968 00:52:38,948 --> 00:52:41,659 and they're about to get one more bit of variety 969 00:52:41,701 --> 00:52:44,287 which is one or two genes that will help them head 970 00:52:44,328 --> 00:52:46,205 off the diseases that we brought here, 971 00:52:47,206 --> 00:52:48,332 not on purpose. 972 00:52:49,417 --> 00:52:51,460 But the cure is on purpose. 973 00:52:55,590 --> 00:52:58,885 We use gene guns to move this gene from wheat 974 00:52:58,926 --> 00:53:03,723 into the American chestnut and that resists the fungus. 975 00:53:03,764 --> 00:53:07,184 (relaxing ominous music) 976 00:53:09,186 --> 00:53:13,274 When genetically modified organisms were first created, 977 00:53:13,316 --> 00:53:17,028 most environmentalists were just automatically against it, 978 00:53:18,738 --> 00:53:21,073 and that actually makes me pretty mad, 979 00:53:22,116 --> 00:53:25,036 because that's taking ideology more seriously 980 00:53:25,077 --> 00:53:28,039 than the ecosystems you're trying to protect. 981 00:53:28,080 --> 00:53:31,125 (people chatting) 982 00:53:31,167 --> 00:53:33,836 But this resistance to technology 983 00:53:33,878 --> 00:53:36,881 and intervention is nothing new. 984 00:53:39,258 --> 00:53:42,011 The environmental movement that formed in the '60s 985 00:53:42,053 --> 00:53:46,265 that I was part of helping shape, was young, 986 00:53:46,307 --> 00:53:50,603 enthusiastic, not terribly scientifically informed. 987 00:53:50,728 --> 00:53:53,731 - I enjoy the trees and the elements, 988 00:53:54,774 --> 00:53:57,193 just things that are very basic to the Earth. 989 00:53:58,319 --> 00:54:01,322 - [Stewart] And it locked in a number of stances. 990 00:54:01,364 --> 00:54:03,574 - Everything we do affects it. 991 00:54:03,616 --> 00:54:05,993 Everything we get comes from it. 992 00:54:06,035 --> 00:54:09,747 Everything we leave goes back into it. 993 00:54:09,789 --> 00:54:11,666 - [Stewart] An environmentalist is automatically 994 00:54:11,707 --> 00:54:13,292 against intervention in nature 995 00:54:13,334 --> 00:54:15,461 because nature is always right 996 00:54:15,503 --> 00:54:17,421 and humanity is always wrong. 997 00:54:17,463 --> 00:54:19,382 - Don't fowl your nest. 998 00:54:23,636 --> 00:54:27,431 - It's a romantic story but it's just wrong. 999 00:54:31,018 --> 00:54:33,312 (people whistling) 1000 00:54:33,354 --> 00:54:37,108 - A lot of the '60 scene had been very anti-technological. 1001 00:54:37,149 --> 00:54:40,152 You have to make a choice between being an environmentalist 1002 00:54:40,194 --> 00:54:41,904 and being a technologist. 1003 00:54:41,946 --> 00:54:46,367 They were seen by many people as at odds with each other. 1004 00:54:46,409 --> 00:54:49,870 Technology was ruining the environment it seemed like. 1005 00:54:49,912 --> 00:54:53,040 Stewart and a few other people said, no actually, 1006 00:54:53,082 --> 00:54:55,084 it's the way we can save it. 1007 00:54:55,126 --> 00:54:57,837 - It's a whole lot of good stuff and it's been for us. 1008 00:54:58,921 --> 00:55:02,174 But we're amplifying it as big as we can. 1009 00:55:04,510 --> 00:55:07,388 - That started Stewart off on a line that differed 1010 00:55:07,555 --> 00:55:10,266 from many of the people he had been associated with 1011 00:55:10,307 --> 00:55:11,225 in that he had begun 1012 00:55:11,267 --> 00:55:13,894 to embrace technology as the way towards the future. 1013 00:55:13,936 --> 00:55:16,772 - It's our biggest problem and nothing's going to be solved. 1014 00:55:16,814 --> 00:55:18,149 No technologies are going 1015 00:55:18,190 --> 00:55:20,943 to manipulate people's minds and feelings. 1016 00:55:20,985 --> 00:55:24,405 (dramatic ominous music) 1017 00:55:25,281 --> 00:55:27,575 - I was starting to feel isolated 1018 00:55:27,616 --> 00:55:29,076 in the environmental movement 1019 00:55:32,246 --> 00:55:36,125 and felt like I was cut off from the rest of the world. 1020 00:55:38,544 --> 00:55:41,589 I was working like mad on the "Whole Earth Catalog" 1021 00:55:41,630 --> 00:55:44,592 and I was reduced in non-catalog function more 1022 00:55:44,633 --> 00:55:46,302 and more and more. 1023 00:55:46,343 --> 00:55:49,013 There was a room in the back of the 4,000 square feet 1024 00:55:49,055 --> 00:55:52,266 where we did the "Whole Earth Catalog" where I had a bed 1025 00:55:52,308 --> 00:55:55,436 and I was doing a lot of my work from that bed. 1026 00:55:55,478 --> 00:55:58,314 (clock ticking) 1027 00:55:58,355 --> 00:56:01,484 (relaxing piano music) 1028 00:56:01,525 --> 00:56:04,904 But I didn't even know to call it depression. 1029 00:56:04,945 --> 00:56:08,532 (pencil grinding on paper) 1030 00:56:11,535 --> 00:56:13,662 I was bad company for my wife. 1031 00:56:17,249 --> 00:56:20,628 (marker grinding on paper) 1032 00:56:20,669 --> 00:56:23,839 The depression I had at that period was also related 1033 00:56:23,881 --> 00:56:26,258 to drug involvement triggered by the amount 1034 00:56:26,300 --> 00:56:27,927 of nitrous oxide I was breathing. 1035 00:56:29,512 --> 00:56:32,932 (dramatic ominous music) 1036 00:56:35,392 --> 00:56:39,647 Nitrous oxide was a party drug in the counter culture. 1037 00:56:41,398 --> 00:56:42,566 You would have a flash 1038 00:56:42,608 --> 00:56:47,613 which might be exciting or revelatory. 1039 00:56:50,324 --> 00:56:52,827 And for a few years I had a tank 1040 00:56:52,868 --> 00:56:55,287 about three feet high delivered once a week 1041 00:56:55,329 --> 00:56:58,249 to the "Whole Earth Catalog" so I could breath it up. 1042 00:56:59,625 --> 00:57:01,836 I got wrapped up in my own mind 1043 00:57:02,002 --> 00:57:05,381 which then turned all convoluted watching itself 1044 00:57:05,422 --> 00:57:07,550 to the point where I could barely drive, 1045 00:57:08,717 --> 00:57:10,886 because I was watching my mind watch my mind 1046 00:57:10,928 --> 00:57:13,931 watch my mind instead of watching the damn road. 1047 00:57:13,973 --> 00:57:15,349 (tires screeching) 1048 00:57:15,391 --> 00:57:17,518 (somber piano music) 1049 00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:22,565 Depression is self-reinforcing and becomes its own system. 1050 00:57:23,983 --> 00:57:27,069 So long after I stopped breathing nitrous oxide, 1051 00:57:27,111 --> 00:57:29,572 I was still badly depressed. 1052 00:57:32,366 --> 00:57:35,578 Basically, I wanted off this runaway train, 1053 00:57:37,496 --> 00:57:39,373 so came up with the idea, 1054 00:57:39,415 --> 00:57:42,293 how about I just stop the success right in its tracks? 1055 00:57:44,378 --> 00:57:45,629 - [Lois] He made the decision that we 1056 00:57:45,671 --> 00:57:47,631 would do the last "Whole Earth Catalog" 1057 00:57:48,799 --> 00:57:50,676 and we sold a million copies. 1058 00:57:53,929 --> 00:57:55,973 - [Stewart] And then as a way to celebrate that 1059 00:57:56,015 --> 00:57:57,808 we put on a public, 1060 00:57:57,850 --> 00:57:59,476 what we call Demise Party. 1061 00:58:00,644 --> 00:58:02,313 (audience applauding) 1062 00:58:02,354 --> 00:58:05,149 - [Lois] We had some money and he made a decision 1063 00:58:05,191 --> 00:58:07,985 that we would do this social experiment. 1064 00:58:09,278 --> 00:58:12,448 - I said, I have here in my hand $20,000 in cash. 1065 00:58:12,489 --> 00:58:16,118 Go on and tell us what you think should happen to the money? 1066 00:58:16,160 --> 00:58:20,623 They money will go to a person with the responsibility 1067 00:58:20,664 --> 00:58:24,043 for seeing it through a project by probably dawn. 1068 00:58:25,377 --> 00:58:27,171 And these are hippies that have been living 1069 00:58:27,213 --> 00:58:29,632 on $200 a year. 1070 00:58:29,673 --> 00:58:33,219 So to be standing there on stage with a pretty thick wad 1071 00:58:33,260 --> 00:58:35,804 of $100 bills and trying to say, well, 1072 00:58:35,846 --> 00:58:37,473 my commune really needs a pump. 1073 00:58:37,514 --> 00:58:40,017 (Stewart chuckling) 1074 00:58:40,059 --> 00:58:42,269 The notions piled up but it turned out most 1075 00:58:42,311 --> 00:58:43,270 of them were bad. 1076 00:58:43,312 --> 00:58:44,605 - I think this money should be used 1077 00:58:44,647 --> 00:58:47,191 to get all the Jews out of Miami 1078 00:58:47,233 --> 00:58:49,652 and get the Puerto Ricans back where they belong. 1079 00:58:49,693 --> 00:58:51,946 - So it was a disappointment in that regard 1080 00:58:51,987 --> 00:58:55,407 'cause my hypothesis had been that under duress people 1081 00:58:55,449 --> 00:58:56,617 would be extra creative. 1082 00:58:56,659 --> 00:58:59,870 We've gotta get together and deal with our problem. 1083 00:58:59,912 --> 00:59:01,705 (man shouting) (cracker exploding) 1084 00:59:01,747 --> 00:59:03,123 What actually turned out to be the case 1085 00:59:03,165 --> 00:59:05,626 was under duress people are extra non-creative. 1086 00:59:05,668 --> 00:59:07,044 - [Man] Well, 'cause you're a fucking (indistinct). 1087 00:59:07,086 --> 00:59:08,629 - [Stewart] It was basically chaotic. 1088 00:59:08,671 --> 00:59:10,881 - You've got nine million suggestions. 1089 00:59:10,923 --> 00:59:13,425 They're all good, pick one. 1090 00:59:13,467 --> 00:59:15,636 This could go on for the next fucking year. 1091 00:59:16,804 --> 00:59:20,266 - I suggest one $100 dollar bill to put in the fireplace. 1092 00:59:20,307 --> 00:59:21,350 - [Stewart] You wanna put $100-- 1093 00:59:21,392 --> 00:59:23,060 One guy, his name's Fred, 1094 00:59:23,102 --> 00:59:26,897 set fire to his $100 bill and said it's not about the money, 1095 00:59:26,939 --> 00:59:29,316 it's about the people. 1096 00:59:29,358 --> 00:59:32,278 And by the end of all this he was the guy 1097 00:59:32,319 --> 00:59:34,405 that took away $20,000. 1098 00:59:36,323 --> 00:59:39,743 (relaxing ominous music) 1099 00:59:41,078 --> 00:59:43,914 (marker grinding on paper) 1100 00:59:43,956 --> 00:59:45,708 It felt like a total failure. 1101 00:59:50,379 --> 00:59:51,380 I was in a bad way 1102 00:59:54,383 --> 00:59:58,762 and I'm shutting down one thing after another to see 1103 00:59:58,804 --> 01:00:01,598 what thing I can get rid of that will give me a chance 1104 01:00:01,640 --> 01:00:02,933 to get myself back? 1105 01:00:02,975 --> 01:00:07,146 (marker grinding on paper) 1106 01:00:07,187 --> 01:00:09,189 So I shut down the "Whole Earth Catalog" 1107 01:00:11,108 --> 01:00:13,527 and I wasn't better. 1108 01:00:13,694 --> 01:00:16,363 (pen grinding on paper) 1109 01:00:16,405 --> 01:00:19,950 And I shut down my marriage. 1110 01:00:22,036 --> 01:00:25,539 By then, being just with her was getting troubled enough 1111 01:00:25,581 --> 01:00:29,251 for me and probably to some extent for her. 1112 01:00:29,293 --> 01:00:31,253 But I initiated the, 1113 01:00:31,295 --> 01:00:32,796 let's not be married anymore. 1114 01:00:34,882 --> 01:00:38,135 - He woke up one morning and he said he wanted a divorce. 1115 01:00:38,177 --> 01:00:40,679 So that was the end of that, okay. 1116 01:00:42,348 --> 01:00:43,265 I still feel cold. 1117 01:00:44,141 --> 01:00:47,394 (somber ominous music) 1118 01:00:58,781 --> 01:01:01,617 (water trickling) 1119 01:01:13,128 --> 01:01:16,298 (upbeat guitar music) 1120 01:01:17,883 --> 01:01:22,221 ♪ Thinking of a world and ♪ the light of the sun ♪ 1121 01:01:22,262 --> 01:01:27,267 ♪ And all the many lives ♪ that were ever begun ♪ 1122 01:01:30,687 --> 01:01:35,692 ♪ Ever begun ♪ 1123 01:01:36,819 --> 01:01:41,448 ♪ Our little world turning in the blue ♪ 1124 01:01:41,490 --> 01:01:46,495 ♪ As each day goes ♪ there's another one new ♪ 1125 01:01:49,748 --> 01:01:54,753 ♪ Another one new ♪ 1126 01:01:56,046 --> 01:02:00,676 ♪ How many people will we feed today ♪ 1127 01:02:00,717 --> 01:02:05,722 ♪ How many lips will we kiss today ♪ 1128 01:02:09,268 --> 01:02:14,273 ♪ If we wake up ♪ 1129 01:02:15,190 --> 01:02:19,862 ♪ How many worlds will we ever see ♪ 1130 01:02:19,903 --> 01:02:24,908 ♪ And how many people can we ever be ♪ 1131 01:02:28,328 --> 01:02:30,998 ♪ If we wake up ♪ 1132 01:02:35,419 --> 01:02:40,048 - The 1970s I spent living alone. 1133 01:02:44,052 --> 01:02:46,555 I was in a lot of stupid pain. 1134 01:02:48,140 --> 01:02:51,435 It took a while to get out of being really shut down 1135 01:02:51,477 --> 01:02:53,270 in terms of feeling good about life. 1136 01:02:54,480 --> 01:02:57,024 (clock ticking) 1137 01:02:57,065 --> 01:03:00,903 (relaxing instrumental music) 1138 01:03:02,362 --> 01:03:05,949 (camera shutter clicking) 1139 01:03:05,991 --> 01:03:08,285 I had seen people get in the mood of, well, 1140 01:03:08,327 --> 01:03:09,453 I'm having a problem with my drug, 1141 01:03:09,620 --> 01:03:12,247 so obviously the answer is I should take more drugs. 1142 01:03:13,248 --> 01:03:15,375 That universally did not work out. 1143 01:03:15,417 --> 01:03:17,628 (Stewart chuckling) 1144 01:03:17,669 --> 01:03:22,174 So one aspect of how I treated being depressed 1145 01:03:22,216 --> 01:03:25,511 at the time was to not try to fix it with drugs. 1146 01:03:26,929 --> 01:03:31,725 I was starting to do meditation and seeing a psychiatrist 1147 01:03:31,767 --> 01:03:33,310 who was actually pretty good. 1148 01:03:34,269 --> 01:03:36,688 And eventually I was able to become more 1149 01:03:36,730 --> 01:03:37,940 and more happy again. 1150 01:03:38,815 --> 01:03:40,776 (relaxing xylophone music) 1151 01:03:40,817 --> 01:03:41,610 And at that point, 1152 01:03:41,652 --> 01:03:43,570 having shut down the "Whole Earth Catalog", 1153 01:03:43,612 --> 01:03:48,033 I was free to pursue a subject I was curious about. 1154 01:03:51,119 --> 01:03:54,790 10 years earlier when I was visiting Stanford, 1155 01:03:54,831 --> 01:03:56,917 I hear male yells from 1156 01:03:56,959 --> 01:03:59,795 what was called the Computation Center. 1157 01:03:59,836 --> 01:04:01,964 And it turns out they were playing the earliest 1158 01:04:02,005 --> 01:04:04,758 of all the video games called "Space War". 1159 01:04:04,800 --> 01:04:06,093 (playful gaming music) 1160 01:04:06,134 --> 01:04:10,180 They were gathered around a mini computer called PDP-1. 1161 01:04:10,222 --> 01:04:14,434 What got me about it was the insane enthusiasm 1162 01:04:14,476 --> 01:04:17,854 and out of body wildness that was going on 1163 01:04:17,896 --> 01:04:19,273 in the players of this game. 1164 01:04:20,899 --> 01:04:24,987 They identified with what I thought of as hippies 1165 01:04:25,028 --> 01:04:27,573 but they weren't doing drugs very much, 1166 01:04:27,614 --> 01:04:29,074 because they had found a better drug 1167 01:04:29,116 --> 01:04:32,494 and the better drug was computer power. 1168 01:04:34,997 --> 01:04:38,041 I wrote it up for "Rolling Stone" 1169 01:04:38,083 --> 01:04:40,002 and I began the article with the line, 1170 01:04:40,168 --> 01:04:40,961 ready or not, 1171 01:04:41,003 --> 01:04:43,255 computers are coming to the people. 1172 01:04:43,297 --> 01:04:46,967 (relaxing xylophone music) 1173 01:04:52,723 --> 01:04:55,434 People get up to strange things 1174 01:04:55,475 --> 01:04:58,020 and people that are good at getting up to strange things, 1175 01:04:58,061 --> 01:04:59,646 get up to more than the one. 1176 01:04:59,688 --> 01:05:00,522 (Stewart chuckling) 1177 01:05:00,564 --> 01:05:01,315 (relaxing upbeat rock music) 1178 01:05:01,481 --> 01:05:02,941 At the end of the Demise Party, 1179 01:05:02,983 --> 01:05:04,276 the guy who'd set fire 1180 01:05:04,318 --> 01:05:07,529 to the $100 bill came away with $20,000. 1181 01:05:08,739 --> 01:05:11,908 - He was this unusual draft resister activist 1182 01:05:11,950 --> 01:05:14,369 community organizer, a guy by the name of Fred Moore. 1183 01:05:14,411 --> 01:05:17,873 He was deeply opposed to the very concept of money, 1184 01:05:17,914 --> 01:05:21,668 so the fact that Fred got the money was really quite ironic. 1185 01:05:21,710 --> 01:05:22,794 Fred took the money, 1186 01:05:22,836 --> 01:05:25,964 put it in his backyard in a coffee can and buried it. 1187 01:05:26,006 --> 01:05:28,800 It was a little bit like Frodo and the ring 1188 01:05:30,010 --> 01:05:32,888 - That same Fred Moore who did a few interesting things 1189 01:05:32,929 --> 01:05:33,889 for that money, 1190 01:05:33,930 --> 01:05:36,850 a couple of years later was one of the founders 1191 01:05:36,892 --> 01:05:39,019 of the Homebrew Computer Club, 1192 01:05:39,061 --> 01:05:41,271 one of the most important groups 1193 01:05:41,313 --> 01:05:43,023 in the history of technology. 1194 01:05:44,024 --> 01:05:46,526 It's where Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak met 1195 01:05:46,568 --> 01:05:47,361 (fast computer beeping) 1196 01:05:47,402 --> 01:05:49,696 and started Apple Computer. 1197 01:05:49,738 --> 01:05:51,114 (computer beeping) 1198 01:05:51,156 --> 01:05:53,825 - [George] Stewart, he was in the thick of that 1199 01:05:53,867 --> 01:05:57,079 and began to actively organizing that community. 1200 01:06:00,791 --> 01:06:04,294 - Stewart and I are both attracted to technologists 1201 01:06:04,336 --> 01:06:05,712 that are on the frontier. 1202 01:06:06,546 --> 01:06:08,965 And because of Stewart I had the opportunity 1203 01:06:09,007 --> 01:06:10,634 to see the very beginning 1204 01:06:10,676 --> 01:06:13,011 of how the internet was gonna play out. 1205 01:06:13,053 --> 01:06:15,639 (static beeping) 1206 01:06:15,681 --> 01:06:18,100 - Ryan Phelan and I took on the organization 1207 01:06:18,141 --> 01:06:20,519 of this event called the Hackers Conference. 1208 01:06:21,937 --> 01:06:24,981 That was the beginning of my involvement 1209 01:06:25,023 --> 01:06:27,734 with the personal computer revolution. 1210 01:06:29,361 --> 01:06:30,195 I'm Stewart Brand. 1211 01:06:30,362 --> 01:06:31,446 I'm not a hacker. 1212 01:06:31,488 --> 01:06:32,989 I'm here for the contact high. 1213 01:06:34,324 --> 01:06:35,409 - [Reporter] One long-time supporter 1214 01:06:35,450 --> 01:06:37,369 of Hackers is Stewart Brand. 1215 01:06:37,411 --> 01:06:41,415 - They are more effective in pushing the culture around now 1216 01:06:41,456 --> 01:06:44,543 in good ways than almost any group I can think of. 1217 01:06:44,584 --> 01:06:46,378 - [Reporter] But the real purpose of the get-together was 1218 01:06:46,420 --> 01:06:48,338 to discuss the unique set of values 1219 01:06:48,380 --> 01:06:50,632 that made the computer revolution possible. 1220 01:06:50,674 --> 01:06:51,758 - Political platform is 1221 01:06:51,800 --> 01:06:55,053 that we need an electronic declaration of independence. 1222 01:06:55,095 --> 01:06:57,347 - [Man] We were trying to liberate the tools 1223 01:06:57,389 --> 01:06:59,224 that had been kept in the hands 1224 01:06:59,266 --> 01:07:01,643 of powerful companies like IBM. 1225 01:07:01,810 --> 01:07:03,729 - Sometimes the companies internally, 1226 01:07:03,770 --> 01:07:04,896 because they own it, 1227 01:07:04,938 --> 01:07:06,481 will squash it and say you cannot have it, 1228 01:07:06,523 --> 01:07:07,649 even though we're not gonna put it out 1229 01:07:07,691 --> 01:07:09,317 and nobody else in the world's gonna get it. 1230 01:07:09,359 --> 01:07:12,237 That's a hiding of information that is wrong. 1231 01:07:12,279 --> 01:07:15,866 - [Stewart] And there was a hacker ethic to be transparent 1232 01:07:15,907 --> 01:07:17,743 and to share code. 1233 01:07:17,784 --> 01:07:18,577 (audience laughing) 1234 01:07:18,618 --> 01:07:21,455 - My project is to make all software free. 1235 01:07:21,496 --> 01:07:22,497 My soul is in that. 1236 01:07:22,539 --> 01:07:25,375 Tools I will give away to anybody. 1237 01:07:25,417 --> 01:07:28,044 - This software I wrote is a desk accessory, 1238 01:07:28,086 --> 01:07:30,255 so it works on top of any other application. 1239 01:07:30,297 --> 01:07:33,091 - This a program that allows you to switch very quickly 1240 01:07:33,133 --> 01:07:36,052 between programs on the map as I can show you here. 1241 01:07:36,094 --> 01:07:38,513 - Stewart was the first guy to get it. 1242 01:07:38,555 --> 01:07:41,266 The personal computer was one of the most powerful examples 1243 01:07:41,308 --> 01:07:45,103 of using machines as tools for independence 1244 01:07:45,145 --> 01:07:47,272 and that you could build your own world 1245 01:07:47,314 --> 01:07:49,232 out of this new technology. 1246 01:07:51,318 --> 01:07:54,821 He saw that hacker's culture shared a lot of values 1247 01:07:54,863 --> 01:07:57,699 with the "Whole Earth Catalog" ideal. 1248 01:07:57,741 --> 01:07:59,910 That information should be freely shared. 1249 01:08:01,620 --> 01:08:03,997 - Stewart was one of the first people who realized that 1250 01:08:04,039 --> 01:08:06,541 that actually was a social movement, 1251 01:08:06,583 --> 01:08:08,835 that wasn't just like a couple of new toys 1252 01:08:08,877 --> 01:08:09,753 that had appeared. 1253 01:08:11,004 --> 01:08:14,633 That's a very typical Stewart thing to understand 1254 01:08:14,674 --> 01:08:16,300 that there is something there, 1255 01:08:17,135 --> 01:08:18,261 to take it seriously, 1256 01:08:18,303 --> 01:08:19,304 to give it a name. 1257 01:08:19,345 --> 01:08:22,849 As soon as you call a situation something, 1258 01:08:22,890 --> 01:08:25,894 the people within it start to look around and say, oh yeah 1259 01:08:25,935 --> 01:08:27,896 it is something, yeah. 1260 01:08:27,938 --> 01:08:30,690 Okay, we're in something together. 1261 01:08:30,732 --> 01:08:33,568 (people chatting) 1262 01:08:37,697 --> 01:08:41,618 - I had been in solo bachelorhood for quite a while 1263 01:08:41,660 --> 01:08:46,414 and one of the things I was missing was conversation. 1264 01:08:48,458 --> 01:08:51,210 And I found that the conversations I was having 1265 01:08:51,253 --> 01:08:53,255 with Ryan Phelan, 1266 01:08:53,296 --> 01:08:55,298 they were some of the best I was having. 1267 01:08:58,134 --> 01:09:01,470 So here we are 35 years later still 1268 01:09:01,513 --> 01:09:02,848 having a good conversation. 1269 01:09:04,057 --> 01:09:06,809 (birds chirping) 1270 01:09:06,852 --> 01:09:10,438 (relaxing xylophone music) 1271 01:09:17,779 --> 01:09:21,157 (door creaking) 1272 01:09:21,324 --> 01:09:22,117 (door banging) 1273 01:09:22,157 --> 01:09:24,995 (water trickling) 1274 01:09:27,706 --> 01:09:28,540 Hello. 1275 01:09:31,334 --> 01:09:32,585 (door banging) 1276 01:09:32,627 --> 01:09:33,460 (water trickling) 1277 01:09:33,628 --> 01:09:35,297 (cups clanging) 1278 01:09:35,337 --> 01:09:36,923 Here you go. 1279 01:09:36,965 --> 01:09:40,301 (relaxing guitar music) 1280 01:09:42,554 --> 01:09:44,889 - It must've been about 1980. 1281 01:09:50,562 --> 01:09:53,773 I think we both realized a mutual appreciation 1282 01:09:53,815 --> 01:09:56,443 of each other that went beyond work. 1283 01:09:59,029 --> 01:10:01,031 We liked taking hikes out in nature. 1284 01:10:03,867 --> 01:10:08,163 Sparks flew and there were some very soulful moments there 1285 01:10:08,204 --> 01:10:10,832 on hillsides where we got to know each other. 1286 01:10:12,541 --> 01:10:14,419 We had realized we had fallen in love. 1287 01:10:15,670 --> 01:10:17,797 We were both pretty fascinated 1288 01:10:17,839 --> 01:10:19,341 with the waterfront community. 1289 01:10:20,342 --> 01:10:22,385 We'd been wandering up and down the docks, 1290 01:10:22,427 --> 01:10:23,594 looking at houseboats. 1291 01:10:23,719 --> 01:10:28,767 Mirene was a rotted out 1912 tugboat 1292 01:10:30,018 --> 01:10:31,978 and we brought her back to life. 1293 01:10:35,148 --> 01:10:36,483 To be honest, 1294 01:10:36,523 --> 01:10:38,360 when Stewart and I started thinking 1295 01:10:38,401 --> 01:10:40,111 about getting a boat together, 1296 01:10:40,153 --> 01:10:42,280 I still didn't really necessarily think 1297 01:10:42,322 --> 01:10:43,823 about it as a marriage. 1298 01:10:44,657 --> 01:10:46,242 I was a product of the '60s 1299 01:10:46,284 --> 01:10:48,452 and marriage was not something 1300 01:10:48,495 --> 01:10:51,831 that I thought was an essential part of a relationship. 1301 01:10:51,873 --> 01:10:53,124 I was kind of in it for the short-term. 1302 01:10:53,166 --> 01:10:57,587 That was great and it was fun and I had no idea 1303 01:10:57,629 --> 01:11:00,090 how profound it would be to actually start 1304 01:11:00,130 --> 01:11:02,258 to create this life with Stewart. 1305 01:11:02,300 --> 01:11:03,259 He surprised me. 1306 01:11:04,177 --> 01:11:08,014 (relaxing guitar music) 1307 01:11:08,056 --> 01:11:10,976 (water trickling) 1308 01:11:12,519 --> 01:11:15,063 I could get used to this. 1309 01:11:15,105 --> 01:11:16,940 - You could get used to this, yeah. 1310 01:11:17,816 --> 01:11:20,652 Ryan and I are always scheming things up. 1311 01:11:20,693 --> 01:11:23,780 We're always advisors to each other's projects. 1312 01:11:23,822 --> 01:11:26,992 But when we work together closely it's just wonderful. 1313 01:11:27,032 --> 01:11:28,535 - You got a seal right here. 1314 01:11:28,576 --> 01:11:30,077 - Really? 1315 01:11:30,120 --> 01:11:31,705 - Shall we swap? 1316 01:11:31,746 --> 01:11:32,664 (seals grunting) 1317 01:11:32,706 --> 01:11:33,915 Look at them all. 1318 01:11:33,957 --> 01:11:35,916 (seals barking) 1319 01:11:35,959 --> 01:11:38,837 - Hi, guys. - Isn't that great? 1320 01:11:38,878 --> 01:11:40,797 (birds chirping) 1321 01:11:40,839 --> 01:11:42,632 (water trickling) 1322 01:11:42,799 --> 01:11:43,967 (elephant trumpeting) 1323 01:11:44,009 --> 01:11:47,262 - [Stewart] The two of us created Revive and Restore, 1324 01:11:47,303 --> 01:11:51,141 which is the entity that is making de-extinction possible. 1325 01:11:52,517 --> 01:11:54,853 (elephant trumpeting) 1326 01:11:54,894 --> 01:11:57,897 - It's not just about bringing back a wooly mammoth, 1327 01:11:59,232 --> 01:12:03,318 but this technology is what's needed for conservation. 1328 01:12:03,361 --> 01:12:05,780 Good afternoon, I'm Ryan Phelan 1329 01:12:05,822 --> 01:12:10,326 and we work at the convergence of biotech and conservation. 1330 01:12:10,368 --> 01:12:13,246 - [Stewart] One thing that biotech is bringing to the rescue 1331 01:12:13,288 --> 01:12:18,293 of endangered species is a chance to get off the defense 1332 01:12:18,501 --> 01:12:20,085 and go on the offense. 1333 01:12:20,128 --> 01:12:22,589 - We have to protect, absolutely. 1334 01:12:22,630 --> 01:12:24,257 We have to intervene 1335 01:12:24,299 --> 01:12:26,675 when these new technologies start to demonstrate-- 1336 01:12:26,718 --> 01:12:30,555 - So Ross, you wanna prevent extinction, 1337 01:12:30,597 --> 01:12:31,889 meanwhile you have other people trying 1338 01:12:31,931 --> 01:12:33,433 to bring species back. 1339 01:12:33,475 --> 01:12:36,311 Where is your moral compass on this? 1340 01:12:36,352 --> 01:12:38,228 - Have we taken on a responsibility 1341 01:12:38,271 --> 01:12:40,231 that has no end point to it? 1342 01:12:40,273 --> 01:12:41,566 I would say, yes, 1343 01:12:41,608 --> 01:12:44,360 because what we're doing is playing God. 1344 01:12:44,402 --> 01:12:45,320 And in that event, 1345 01:12:45,361 --> 01:12:47,572 we have to look at it in the same way 1346 01:12:47,614 --> 01:12:50,825 that we would look at obligations to any living thing. 1347 01:12:53,119 --> 01:12:54,579 - About 10 years ago, 1348 01:12:54,621 --> 01:12:57,749 Stewart asked me to participate in a meeting 1349 01:12:57,791 --> 01:13:00,293 that was going to take up de-extinction. 1350 01:13:00,335 --> 01:13:03,296 I'm at paleomammalogist and the idea of being able 1351 01:13:03,463 --> 01:13:07,550 to actually interact with a living wooly mammoth, 1352 01:13:08,593 --> 01:13:11,971 this was astounding and I was totally fascinated, 1353 01:13:12,013 --> 01:13:12,847 I admit it. 1354 01:13:16,226 --> 01:13:17,519 (birds chirping) 1355 01:13:17,559 --> 01:13:20,563 But although the idea of bringing back species 1356 01:13:20,605 --> 01:13:23,566 that are no longer with us is immensely attractive, 1357 01:13:25,527 --> 01:13:27,445 I also understand it's 1358 01:13:27,487 --> 01:13:29,739 about the worst thing we could possibly do. 1359 01:13:34,369 --> 01:13:36,496 Stewart Brand is a visionary. 1360 01:13:36,538 --> 01:13:37,496 I, by contrast, 1361 01:13:37,539 --> 01:13:38,623 am a pragmatist. 1362 01:13:39,958 --> 01:13:41,918 What's the length of time that we're talking about 1363 01:13:41,960 --> 01:13:45,255 to make and to manufacturer a wooly mammoth? 1364 01:13:45,296 --> 01:13:47,132 Stewart thinks centuries. 1365 01:13:47,173 --> 01:13:47,966 So do I. 1366 01:13:48,007 --> 01:13:51,302 And that's a long period of time to keep interest up 1367 01:13:51,344 --> 01:13:54,430 in an experiment that has no certain outcome. 1368 01:13:54,472 --> 01:13:58,059 (relaxing xylophone music) 1369 01:14:01,563 --> 01:14:05,400 - We are a major force now in this dynamic planet 1370 01:14:05,441 --> 01:14:10,446 and we have to function as an entire global civilization, 1371 01:14:11,948 --> 01:14:15,869 patiently over time with awareness and continuity. 1372 01:14:16,911 --> 01:14:18,580 And we've never done that before. 1373 01:14:20,498 --> 01:14:21,958 There are issues going on 1374 01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:25,712 in the world like climate change and extinction 1375 01:14:27,046 --> 01:14:30,300 and it's gonna take centuries to sort them out. 1376 01:14:35,221 --> 01:14:36,639 One of the problems now is 1377 01:14:36,681 --> 01:14:40,309 that civilization is revving itself 1378 01:14:40,351 --> 01:14:43,478 into a pathologically short attention span. 1379 01:14:53,406 --> 01:14:57,535 When I met Stewart it was getting to be the early '90s 1380 01:14:57,577 --> 01:14:59,537 and people were still thinking 1381 01:14:59,579 --> 01:15:02,332 about the future as being in the year 2,000. 1382 01:15:03,458 --> 01:15:05,001 And I realized that the future had kind 1383 01:15:05,168 --> 01:15:09,005 of been shrinking by one year per year for my whole life. 1384 01:15:09,047 --> 01:15:10,965 That's when I started designing this clock 1385 01:15:11,007 --> 01:15:13,425 that would last for 10,000 years. 1386 01:15:13,468 --> 01:15:17,388 (dramatic ominous drum music) 1387 01:15:17,430 --> 01:15:19,933 - [Stewart] I heard from Danny Hillis about his idea 1388 01:15:19,974 --> 01:15:23,394 to build Estonian scale mechanical clock 1389 01:15:23,436 --> 01:15:25,647 that would tick once a Century, 1390 01:15:25,688 --> 01:15:27,941 more in every thousand years and after much longer than 1391 01:15:27,982 --> 01:15:29,609 that the cuckoo comes out. 1392 01:15:29,651 --> 01:15:31,986 (dramatic ominous drum music) 1393 01:15:32,028 --> 01:15:34,864 - [Danny] Stewart realized the 10,000-year clock 1394 01:15:34,906 --> 01:15:36,032 would change how people thought 1395 01:15:36,074 --> 01:15:37,532 about time long before I did, 1396 01:15:37,575 --> 01:15:39,327 even when I was building it. 1397 01:15:39,369 --> 01:15:40,327 (dramatic ominous drum music) 1398 01:15:40,370 --> 01:15:44,249 (marker grinding on paper) 1399 01:15:44,290 --> 01:15:46,166 - [Stewart] There are ways to help each other behave 1400 01:15:46,209 --> 01:15:49,754 more responsibly and we want people to think 1401 01:15:49,796 --> 01:15:51,880 about the next 10,000 years the way they think 1402 01:15:51,923 --> 01:15:53,508 about next week. 1403 01:15:56,886 --> 01:16:00,473 The photographs of the earth from space 50 years ago 1404 01:16:00,514 --> 01:16:02,934 gave humanity a whole new way to think about itself 1405 01:16:02,976 --> 01:16:05,937 and about the planet that we live on, 1406 01:16:05,978 --> 01:16:08,481 but it didn't really teach us anything about time. 1407 01:16:09,357 --> 01:16:12,443 We need icons that give people a sense 1408 01:16:12,485 --> 01:16:14,987 of long-term thinking. 1409 01:16:16,239 --> 01:16:19,575 (rolling door grinding) 1410 01:16:21,911 --> 01:16:25,748 (lights pinging on in tandem) 1411 01:16:27,083 --> 01:16:30,378 - To make something last for 10,000 years you have 1412 01:16:30,420 --> 01:16:35,174 to choose materials that can last, like titanium. 1413 01:16:37,135 --> 01:16:37,969 You make things very, 1414 01:16:38,011 --> 01:16:40,930 very large so that the wear doesn't matter much. 1415 01:16:42,557 --> 01:16:46,436 But actually by far the hardest problem is making something 1416 01:16:46,477 --> 01:16:48,813 that people will care about for 10,000 years. 1417 01:16:51,648 --> 01:16:54,568 - When we started building the clock, 1418 01:16:54,736 --> 01:16:57,155 we had talked about the idea of the clock having a chime. 1419 01:16:57,196 --> 01:16:59,699 Because it will be beautiful if this was almost subsonic 1420 01:16:59,741 --> 01:17:00,825 or even subsonic. 1421 01:17:00,867 --> 01:17:01,826 And I thought, 1422 01:17:01,868 --> 01:17:03,702 well, if you had 10 bells you would 1423 01:17:03,745 --> 01:17:07,498 have three million possible permutations of those 10 bells. 1424 01:17:07,540 --> 01:17:09,000 Just the sound of the clock. 1425 01:17:09,041 --> 01:17:10,209 (mechanisms clicking) 1426 01:17:10,251 --> 01:17:12,837 That meant you could have a different chime each day 1427 01:17:12,879 --> 01:17:14,172 for 10,000 years. 1428 01:17:14,213 --> 01:17:17,300 (clock bell chiming) 1429 01:17:19,594 --> 01:17:20,594 - [Stewart] We're trying to figure out what kind 1430 01:17:20,636 --> 01:17:23,264 of a site should it be for a clock? 1431 01:17:23,306 --> 01:17:26,225 And we decided it should be kind of a pilgrimage site. 1432 01:17:28,895 --> 01:17:31,647 So after much exploration, 1433 01:17:31,689 --> 01:17:35,818 we're now putting a very large clock inside a 500-foot shaft 1434 01:17:35,860 --> 01:17:37,403 inside a mountain. 1435 01:17:37,445 --> 01:17:38,905 - It's in analog. - The big clock 1436 01:17:38,946 --> 01:17:39,822 probably just going. 1437 01:17:39,864 --> 01:17:40,573 (Stewart imitating chiming) 1438 01:17:40,740 --> 01:17:43,743 (dramatic explosion) 1439 01:17:43,868 --> 01:17:47,163 (cable tension pinging) 1440 01:17:48,831 --> 01:17:53,835 If the clock is an artwork then it's already an expression 1441 01:17:53,960 --> 01:17:55,922 of thinking long term. 1442 01:17:55,963 --> 01:17:59,050 (clock bell chiming) 1443 01:18:08,226 --> 01:18:10,728 - The clock is a provocation in a sense. 1444 01:18:13,356 --> 01:18:17,110 You're hoping to consciously put into the world something 1445 01:18:17,151 --> 01:18:18,861 that would give people that flash, 1446 01:18:18,903 --> 01:18:20,780 that moment of saying, wow, 1447 01:18:20,822 --> 01:18:23,699 I see, is it possible that we could be around 1448 01:18:23,741 --> 01:18:25,159 for 10,000 years? 1449 01:18:26,244 --> 01:18:27,620 What if there's a war? 1450 01:18:27,662 --> 01:18:29,288 Or what if a astroid hits the earth 1451 01:18:29,330 --> 01:18:31,332 and there's a nuclear winter? 1452 01:18:32,708 --> 01:18:34,960 Even saying, what if, 1453 01:18:35,002 --> 01:18:38,755 is starting to do what the clock is intended to do. 1454 01:18:38,798 --> 01:18:41,884 (clock bell chiming) 1455 01:18:47,764 --> 01:18:52,186 - I think we're in the shift point in the long story, 1456 01:18:53,271 --> 01:18:55,440 finding out how nature actually works, 1457 01:18:55,481 --> 01:18:57,316 finding out how we actually work. 1458 01:19:00,068 --> 01:19:03,656 And de-extinction is a good way of keeping people reminded 1459 01:19:03,698 --> 01:19:08,119 that they're gonna bear down on some issues for a long time. 1460 01:19:08,161 --> 01:19:12,123 And when you do that astounding things can be accomplished, 1461 01:19:12,165 --> 01:19:15,084 including bringing back wooly mammoths. 1462 01:19:15,126 --> 01:19:18,379 In fact, bring back the whole damn mammoth steppe, 1463 01:19:18,421 --> 01:19:21,257 change that biome back to what it used to be, 1464 01:19:21,299 --> 01:19:22,550 which would be better for the climate, 1465 01:19:22,592 --> 01:19:24,177 and that's a long-term story. 1466 01:19:25,178 --> 01:19:27,763 (bell chiming) 1467 01:19:40,151 --> 01:19:41,443 - The Greek word, hubris, 1468 01:19:42,445 --> 01:19:46,574 has to do with the idea that a hero has a central failing 1469 01:19:46,616 --> 01:19:47,575 that he's not aware of, 1470 01:19:49,327 --> 01:19:51,077 but the failing eventually comes out 1471 01:19:51,120 --> 01:19:53,414 and usually results in disaster. 1472 01:19:53,456 --> 01:19:56,876 (relaxing chiming music) 1473 01:20:00,922 --> 01:20:05,009 I think that's a very word for the de-extinction agenda. 1474 01:20:05,050 --> 01:20:06,219 It is hubris. 1475 01:20:06,260 --> 01:20:07,512 (audience applauding) 1476 01:20:07,553 --> 01:20:09,263 (audience cheering) 1477 01:20:09,305 --> 01:20:11,098 - Remember Jurassic park, 1478 01:20:11,139 --> 01:20:14,559 amazing movie where science brings dinosaurs 1479 01:20:14,602 --> 01:20:16,478 back from extinction. 1480 01:20:16,521 --> 01:20:18,314 The science is now getting real. 1481 01:20:18,356 --> 01:20:21,067 Right now scientists and thinkers are working on a way 1482 01:20:21,108 --> 01:20:25,780 to revive other extinct species like the wooly mammoth. 1483 01:20:25,821 --> 01:20:28,616 To paraphrase Jeff Goldblum, should they? 1484 01:20:28,782 --> 01:20:31,536 Here to be making his opening statement, 1485 01:20:31,577 --> 01:20:33,371 ladies and gentlemen, Stewart Brand. 1486 01:20:35,289 --> 01:20:38,251 - I've been a conservationist since I was 10, 1487 01:20:38,291 --> 01:20:40,503 just 70 years ago, 1488 01:20:40,545 --> 01:20:45,091 and what's driving us now is getting some species back. 1489 01:20:45,132 --> 01:20:47,510 You will be having the chestnut trees coming back, 1490 01:20:47,552 --> 01:20:51,097 raining down sweet nuts for wildlife and for humans. 1491 01:20:51,138 --> 01:20:53,266 You will have passenger pigeons back, 1492 01:20:53,307 --> 01:20:56,394 taking up their old habitat which is perfectly intact 1493 01:20:56,434 --> 01:20:57,645 and waiting for them. 1494 01:20:57,687 --> 01:21:02,483 So a vote for de-extinction is a vote for more life. 1495 01:21:02,525 --> 01:21:03,985 (audience applauding) (audience cheering) 1496 01:21:04,026 --> 01:21:04,943 - All right, thank you very much ladies 1497 01:21:04,986 --> 01:21:06,737 and gentleman, Stewart Brand. 1498 01:21:06,779 --> 01:21:09,198 (audience applauding) 1499 01:21:09,240 --> 01:21:11,284 Stewart, but I would like to let your opponents respond 1500 01:21:11,325 --> 01:21:12,743 to that last point. 1501 01:21:12,785 --> 01:21:16,706 - Why do we think we can do this with elephants? 1502 01:21:16,746 --> 01:21:18,583 Elephants are sentient creatures. 1503 01:21:18,624 --> 01:21:20,376 They have self-awareness. 1504 01:21:20,418 --> 01:21:24,171 Human babies, until they're six months or a year or so, 1505 01:21:24,213 --> 01:21:25,005 are not self-aware. 1506 01:21:25,047 --> 01:21:26,632 Your dog isn't self-aware. 1507 01:21:26,674 --> 01:21:29,218 So why are we considering them the kind of property 1508 01:21:29,260 --> 01:21:31,387 that we can mess with and then set them loose? 1509 01:21:31,429 --> 01:21:32,722 Is that really their job? 1510 01:21:32,763 --> 01:21:34,932 - Okay, that's a perfectly phrased question. 1511 01:21:34,974 --> 01:21:37,518 I want to bring it to George Church. 1512 01:21:37,559 --> 01:21:41,063 - Excellent point and I sympathize. 1513 01:21:42,064 --> 01:21:44,817 However, they are currently not 1514 01:21:44,859 --> 01:21:47,111 having such a happy life going extinct. 1515 01:21:47,153 --> 01:21:48,237 (audience laughing) 1516 01:21:48,279 --> 01:21:50,489 I agree that we should be humane. 1517 01:21:50,531 --> 01:21:52,532 We should do something that's for their benefit, 1518 01:21:52,575 --> 01:21:55,119 not just the benefit of the planet. 1519 01:21:55,161 --> 01:21:58,039 I think the ends and the means should be humane. 1520 01:21:58,080 --> 01:21:59,540 - The real de-extinction agenda, 1521 01:21:59,582 --> 01:22:03,169 which is bringing back completely extinct species, 1522 01:22:03,210 --> 01:22:06,172 it's not for repairing ecosystems 1523 01:22:06,297 --> 01:22:08,883 that in a sense don't need repairing anymore 1524 01:22:08,924 --> 01:22:11,594 because we're already 10,000 years down the pike 1525 01:22:11,636 --> 01:22:12,719 from what they were. 1526 01:22:12,762 --> 01:22:14,347 The planet is getting warmer. 1527 01:22:14,388 --> 01:22:16,307 Whether or not we get elephants 1528 01:22:16,349 --> 01:22:19,559 up into Northern Siberia is not going 1529 01:22:19,602 --> 01:22:21,603 to change the equation sufficiently 1530 01:22:21,646 --> 01:22:24,357 to turn the whole process back. 1531 01:22:24,398 --> 01:22:25,358 The real problem, 1532 01:22:25,398 --> 01:22:27,276 as usual, is us. 1533 01:22:28,235 --> 01:22:29,612 - Stewart, to response? 1534 01:22:29,654 --> 01:22:30,571 (audience applauding) 1535 01:22:30,737 --> 01:22:32,365 - Wooly mammoths and the mammoth steppe 1536 01:22:32,406 --> 01:22:34,116 are not gonna fix climate change, 1537 01:22:34,157 --> 01:22:36,327 but they could be over the long-term part 1538 01:22:36,369 --> 01:22:38,162 of the stabilization of climate. 1539 01:22:38,204 --> 01:22:39,538 - I have to say, Stewart, 1540 01:22:39,580 --> 01:22:42,666 that I'm very pleased that I am not the most naive person 1541 01:22:42,708 --> 01:22:43,709 on the panel tonight. 1542 01:22:43,751 --> 01:22:45,753 (audience laughing) (audience applauding) 1543 01:22:45,795 --> 01:22:48,380 - All right, we try not to make it personal. 1544 01:22:48,422 --> 01:22:49,882 (people chuckling) 1545 01:22:49,924 --> 01:22:50,758 - It's a joke. 1546 01:22:50,800 --> 01:22:51,925 - I'm trying to think of not naive, 1547 01:22:51,967 --> 01:22:54,594 it's not that cutting but it was there. 1548 01:22:54,637 --> 01:22:57,098 So let's try to keep it above board. 1549 01:22:57,973 --> 01:22:59,934 Dr. Lynn Rothschild? 1550 01:22:59,975 --> 01:23:02,603 - In the end we've been dancing around this idea 1551 01:23:02,645 --> 01:23:04,021 of what is natural. 1552 01:23:04,063 --> 01:23:06,315 Is it natural to have a wooly mammoth 1553 01:23:06,357 --> 01:23:07,775 on the Siberian steppes? 1554 01:23:07,817 --> 01:23:11,612 Or is it more natural to have a sky filled with teradactyls 1555 01:23:11,779 --> 01:23:14,448 or maybe a sea filled with trilobites. 1556 01:23:14,490 --> 01:23:16,701 Jurassic park was a bad idea. 1557 01:23:16,742 --> 01:23:18,702 Pleistocene Park is no better. 1558 01:23:18,744 --> 01:23:21,080 So no matter how cool this seems, 1559 01:23:21,121 --> 01:23:23,374 we should not de-extinct creatures. 1560 01:23:25,668 --> 01:23:27,712 - And now it's time to learn which side that you feel 1561 01:23:27,878 --> 01:23:29,088 has been more convincing? 1562 01:23:29,130 --> 01:23:29,922 Lynn and Ross, 1563 01:23:29,964 --> 01:23:31,799 they pulled up 17 percentage points. 1564 01:23:31,841 --> 01:23:33,509 That's the number to beat. 1565 01:23:33,550 --> 01:23:34,552 Stewart and George, 1566 01:23:34,593 --> 01:23:36,344 they lost four percentage points. 1567 01:23:36,387 --> 01:23:37,388 That means that the winner 1568 01:23:37,430 --> 01:23:39,348 of this debate is the side arguing, 1569 01:23:39,389 --> 01:23:41,767 don't bring extinct creatures back to life. 1570 01:23:41,809 --> 01:23:44,478 (audience applauding) 1571 01:23:44,603 --> 01:23:48,107 (relaxing chiming music) 1572 01:23:53,654 --> 01:23:58,117 - I think what will change people's minds is the change 1573 01:23:58,159 --> 01:23:59,326 in the facts, 1574 01:23:59,368 --> 01:24:00,536 change in the data. 1575 01:24:01,996 --> 01:24:03,539 And we're all still waiting 1576 01:24:03,581 --> 01:24:06,666 for actual de-extinction to occur. 1577 01:24:06,709 --> 01:24:10,212 (dramatic ominous music) 1578 01:24:17,844 --> 01:24:22,308 I wish I could see the wooly mammoth back in the wild 1579 01:24:22,349 --> 01:24:25,686 and that probably won't happen in my lifetime, 1580 01:24:25,728 --> 01:24:28,397 but I have lived to see American chestnuts come back. 1581 01:24:29,982 --> 01:24:33,068 (door clicking) 1582 01:24:33,110 --> 01:24:37,114 (relaxing upbeat chiming music) 1583 01:24:38,282 --> 01:24:39,241 - [Man] These are all destined to go out 1584 01:24:39,282 --> 01:24:40,409 in the field this year. 1585 01:24:47,750 --> 01:24:49,877 - Back in the day I said that, 1586 01:24:49,919 --> 01:24:52,463 we are as gods and might as well get good at it, 1587 01:24:54,215 --> 01:24:55,966 but it's really becoming, 1588 01:24:56,008 --> 01:24:57,843 we are as nature, 1589 01:24:59,261 --> 01:25:02,932 and using nature to do things that nature does already. 1590 01:25:08,437 --> 01:25:13,442 In my mind this is a forest we're flying over at altitude. 1591 01:25:13,818 --> 01:25:15,027 - [Lady] I like that idea. 1592 01:25:15,945 --> 01:25:17,237 (relaxing upbeat music) 1593 01:25:17,279 --> 01:25:20,074 - American chestnut is the first de-extinction 1594 01:25:21,032 --> 01:25:23,911 and then trees will be planted by the thousands. 1595 01:25:26,956 --> 01:25:30,584 And that was not possible two decades ago. 1596 01:25:30,751 --> 01:25:32,085 Now it's not only possible, 1597 01:25:32,127 --> 01:25:33,462 it's the way it's gonna be. 1598 01:25:42,429 --> 01:25:44,348 Okay, is that about right? 1599 01:25:44,389 --> 01:25:45,224 It's good? 1600 01:25:48,102 --> 01:25:51,522 These little American chestnuts can live a Century 1601 01:25:51,564 --> 01:25:52,982 or more in getting arms. 1602 01:25:53,023 --> 01:25:56,068 And eventually in this century the American chestnut 1603 01:25:56,110 --> 01:26:00,114 should be completely back in the Eastern forest 1604 01:26:00,155 --> 01:26:00,990 and I can't wait. 1605 01:26:06,327 --> 01:26:09,748 (relaxing chiming music) 1606 01:26:24,763 --> 01:26:29,184 For me as a conservationist to engage seriously 1607 01:26:29,226 --> 01:26:32,353 with an ecosystem that you may care about, 1608 01:26:32,396 --> 01:26:36,025 gives you a place to live that isn't inside your own skin 1609 01:26:37,484 --> 01:26:40,946 and takes down some of the dread of death 1610 01:26:43,157 --> 01:26:45,367 and engages a larger life. 1611 01:26:51,498 --> 01:26:55,085 (chain rustling on rock) 1612 01:26:55,127 --> 01:26:58,547 (relaxing chiming music) 1613 01:27:10,684 --> 01:27:14,021 (boots banging on wood) 1614 01:27:24,114 --> 01:27:26,784 (door rumbling) 1615 01:27:30,329 --> 01:27:33,916 (door bang echoing in shaft) 1616 01:28:05,698 --> 01:28:08,117 (metal scraping) 1617 01:28:08,157 --> 01:28:11,662 (overhead crane clicking) 1618 01:28:13,288 --> 01:28:16,041 (tools clanging) 1619 01:28:20,713 --> 01:28:23,799 (clock bell chiming) 1620 01:28:30,222 --> 01:28:33,308 (clock bell chiming) 1621 01:28:38,647 --> 01:28:41,400 (birds chirping) 1622 01:28:45,779 --> 01:28:48,073 People wind up writing memoirs 1623 01:28:48,115 --> 01:28:49,616 because they want their children to know 1624 01:28:49,657 --> 01:28:51,410 what their life was really like. 1625 01:28:54,329 --> 01:28:58,083 People are really interested in their parents' story, 1626 01:28:58,125 --> 01:29:01,085 maybe their grandparents' story. 1627 01:29:01,128 --> 01:29:04,548 (relaxing chiming music) 1628 01:29:08,761 --> 01:29:10,637 Generations is a good way to think, 1629 01:29:12,389 --> 01:29:15,184 but let's go way longer than that. 1630 01:29:22,900 --> 01:29:25,986 (clock bell chiming) 1631 01:29:36,663 --> 01:29:40,666 Once you are holding these longer timeframes in mind, 1632 01:29:41,794 --> 01:29:43,420 that starts to raise the question 1633 01:29:43,462 --> 01:29:45,839 of what do you do on Monday? 1634 01:29:49,760 --> 01:29:54,764 Does your behavior start to reflect this larger frame? 1635 01:29:55,139 --> 01:29:58,227 (clock bell chiming) 1636 01:29:58,268 --> 01:30:00,938 (clock ticking) 1637 01:30:14,159 --> 01:30:17,329 ("This" by Brian Eno) 1638 01:30:29,133 --> 01:30:31,468 ♪ This chord ♪ 1639 01:30:31,510 --> 01:30:33,637 ♪ This water ♪ 1640 01:30:33,679 --> 01:30:35,848 ♪ This son ♪ 1641 01:30:35,889 --> 01:30:38,267 ♪ This daughter ♪ 1642 01:30:38,308 --> 01:30:40,477 ♪ This day ♪ 1643 01:30:40,519 --> 01:30:42,813 ♪ This time ♪ 1644 01:30:42,855 --> 01:30:47,776 ♪ This land, it's all mine ♪ 1645 01:30:47,818 --> 01:30:49,987 ♪ This Calling Bell ♪ 1646 01:30:50,028 --> 01:30:52,281 ♪ This Forge Bell ♪ 1647 01:30:52,322 --> 01:30:54,575 ♪ This Dark Bell ♪ 1648 01:30:54,616 --> 01:30:56,869 ♪ This, The Knife Bell ♪ 1649 01:30:56,910 --> 01:30:59,163 ♪ This calling ♪ 1650 01:30:59,204 --> 01:31:01,582 ♪ This burden ♪ 1651 01:31:01,623 --> 01:31:03,750 ♪ This falling ♪ 1652 01:31:03,791 --> 01:31:08,797 ♪ The world's turning ♪ 1653 01:31:10,924 --> 01:31:13,135 ♪ This, what I thought I knew ♪ 1654 01:31:13,177 --> 01:31:15,429 ♪ This, what I thought was true ♪ 1655 01:31:15,469 --> 01:31:17,764 ♪ This, I understood ♪ 1656 01:31:17,806 --> 01:31:20,058 ♪ This, in the deep wood ♪ 1657 01:31:20,100 --> 01:31:22,978 ♪ This, ah there I stood ♪ 1658 01:31:23,020 --> 01:31:28,025 ♪ A child so fair ♪ 1659 01:31:29,276 --> 01:31:31,737 ♪ This, on a certain square ♪ 1660 01:31:31,778 --> 01:31:33,906 ♪ This, down the dirty stairs ♪ 1661 01:31:33,947 --> 01:31:36,241 ♪ This, to see the table set ♪ 1662 01:31:36,282 --> 01:31:38,702 ♪ This, with golden chairs ♪ 1663 01:31:38,744 --> 01:31:43,165 ♪ This, ah to follow, follow ♪ 1664 01:31:43,207 --> 01:31:46,460 ♪ Follow, follow there ♪ 1665 01:32:15,781 --> 01:32:17,741 ♪ This race ♪ 1666 01:32:17,782 --> 01:32:20,244 ♪ And this world ♪ 1667 01:32:20,285 --> 01:32:22,371 ♪ This feeling ♪ 1668 01:32:22,412 --> 01:32:24,665 ♪ And this girl ♪ 1669 01:32:24,706 --> 01:32:27,125 ♪ This revolver ♪ 1670 01:32:27,166 --> 01:32:29,419 ♪ This fire ♪ 1671 01:32:29,460 --> 01:32:32,172 ♪ This, I'll hold it up ♪ 1672 01:32:32,214 --> 01:32:35,467 ♪ Higher, higher, high ♪